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Fence Building Questions

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-03-28 9:40 AM (#57929)
Subject: Fence Building Questions



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I will be fencing my pasture this summer. I have done barbless wire electric fences before, but overall, I am pretty new to the fence-building game.

One option I am considering is the 1/4 inch rope with stainless steel conductors in it. How is this type of fence tensioned? I am assuming a normal fence stretcher cannot be used on it. My longest run will be about 900 feet.
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Tim
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2007-03-29 7:26 AM (#57975 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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They should sell you a stretcher with the rest of the fence stuff. You pull it by hand to set the tension. I've gone to Electrobraid on the whole farm and I really like it. It's got a nice clean look and the horses don't crowd it.
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-03-29 9:37 AM (#57981 - in reply to #57975)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Originally written by Tim on 2007-03-29 7:26 AM

They should sell you a stretcher with the rest of the fence stuff. You pull it by hand to set the tension.


By stretcher, do you mean the spring assembly, similar to what is used with high-tensile wire? I think I read somewhere that the rope should be pulled to something like 35 lbs, which should be able to be hand-pulled easy enough. But the spring assembly would have to be a lot lighter duty than the high-tensile springs.

I half laughed when I read "They." I am trying to figure out who "They" is around here. I haven't found a place locally, yet, that knows much. I am not sure who really stocks this stuff. I spent at least a couple hours last night in Tractor Supply Company and Mills Fleet Farm, and there was nobody to ask for help. TSC sells rope, but no splices or other goodies. Fleet Farm had rope and splices, and insulators that I think will work, but no spring assemblies or all the stuff I see on the websites. I hate to resort to buying everything online.

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Rich M.
Reg. Sep 2005
Posted 2007-03-29 6:16 PM (#58017 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Echoing Tim I have Electrobraid and love it. 7 years and no problems, all installed by SO and myself. They have a stretching tool which is a rope ratchet deal. Also these are available at Home Depot and Lowes. Electrobraid sells a tool that clamps onto the fence. It's a very easy install and depending on your icing conditions line posts can be as much as 100' apart on level ground. Mine run about 50' and you need to build good corners.All the tools to estimate are on their website. I don't know if they still do but they had local reps that would come to your site and do the takeoff for you, they were paid by electrobraid on comission.Mine has survived ice storms, fallen trees ,snagged by the bushhog, me running into it and stretching it way out, no breaks.You can do it!. Rich
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Tim
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2007-03-30 7:05 AM (#58048 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Rich has got it right. I ordered mine online through them with no problems. The intructions are very simple and easy to follow. Their website is very informative. If you have any problems, you can call them and talk to a real person. Elecrobraid is a great fence and very cost effective.
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-03-30 9:02 AM (#58057 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Rich M. and Tim, am I correct in assuming both of you have used Electrobraid brand, not a different brand with a similar product?

It seems there is quite a variety of quality offered by the available products.

Does anybody have experience with another brand--good or bad?

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gottaride
Reg. Mar 2007
Posted 2007-03-30 12:52 PM (#58096 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Location: Minnesota
All our fencing is smooth wire, but our stud is in 3 strand-electric tape- 'Zareba' brand. Its super easy to put up, and you just tighten the strands by hand. The tape we use is 1" wide (white)- very visible, but not so much against snow! The insulators are all plastic, and I have had a few of the brake on me, but they are simple to replace. We also use a solar-fencer, so I never have to worry about power outages. There is good and bad to all types- its a matter of personal preference & budget. The tape looks real nice, and if ya keep it tight, the wind never affects it- but I would never hesitate to try the braided ropes either.
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kcnyellow
Reg. Aug 2006
Posted 2007-03-30 5:28 PM (#58119 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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I have ordered the 1/4" braided rope that Ramm Fencing sells and it's absolutely fantastic.  It looks great, the horses respect it, and I've not had one bit of trouble with it.  We put it up ourselves, followed the directions Ramm provided, and it's pretty much been maintenance free.  For my cross fencing, I used some endura soft electric rope that I purchased from Premier Fencing and I think it too is an outstanding product.  Both of these companies offer excellent customer service and quality products.  Now that I've used it, I won't go back to anything else.  I just have to find a way to keep the tumbleweeds from blowing through.......
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-03-30 10:07 PM (#58135 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Thanks. Right now the two I am most considering are the Electrobraid brand name stuff and the Endurasoft. Premier 1 is also coming out with a new rope product this summer, that may be an option. But all my research of the higher quality products consists of looking at websites. I will try to take a look at some options at the Minnesota Horse Expo in St Paul in April.
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Tim
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2007-03-31 7:57 AM (#58142 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Yes, my fence is Electrobraid. They use copper in the rope and claim it is better than steel for conducting electricity. I think it's warranty is 20 or 25 years. I was like you and looked at a variety of options, but went with the Electrobraid. I'm sure there are lots of good quality options.
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Rich M.
Reg. Sep 2005
Posted 2007-03-31 11:40 AM (#58155 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Mine is genuine Electrobraid and it is very high quality. I have seen a couple of other brands usually in TSC or like stores. The quality is not the same. Electrobraid will send you a sample and video for free. It's a little more upfront but it is worth it. The Electrobraid rep told me usually the posts rot out before you need to worry about the fence. Rich
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-04-02 12:47 PM (#58298 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Thanks all.  Any more opinions are always welcome.

I have a roll of the cheap stuff ($40 per 660 ft) that I use for my temporary fence while camping.  It works fine for that, but even after only 2 years of using it off and on, I can tell it would not be the best choice for a permanent application.  From the sound of it, the brand name stuff is much better.

I will try to post back when I have my new fence installed

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-04-12 11:14 AM (#59116 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Well, I don't have the rope, yet, but last Saturday we worked on corner posts.  I put a few pictures in an album on here.  Yes, the white stuff is snow.  But the ground had thawed during the 3-4 previous weeks.

http://www.horsetrailerworld.com/forum/photos/photo-thumbnails.asp?albumid=88

I haven't figured out exactly how to get a photo into the post.  The photos from an album don't have their own url, so the "Insert Image" button doesn't work for me.

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PaulChristenson
Reg. Jan 2007
Posted 2007-04-13 7:33 PM (#59239 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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440 Fence has an excellent product...

http://www.440fence.com/index.cfm?page=7&subpage=38

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-04-16 8:54 AM (#59382 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Yes, that 440 fence looks like good stuff.


On a 4-strand electric fence, which strand should be the ground? 2nd strand from the top? 3rd strand from the top?
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-04-30 12:00 PM (#60187 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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For cost reasons, I was thinking of going with Electrobraid as the top strand, and the remaining three strands would be barbless wire. I figure this would save me about $2000 over all Electrobraid on my approximate mile of fence. I talked to two Electrobraid dealers at the MN Horse Expo last weekend. One said that he would not recommend doing that, since the Electrobraid has copper conductors and the barbless wire is galvanized steel. He said it would cause galvanic corrosion, which I hadn't thought of. He suggested, instead, going with a coated high tensile wire for the visible strand(s). Any thoughts on this?
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huntseat
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2007-04-30 12:53 PM (#60191 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Corrosion will only happen if you allow them to touch and one is ALUMINUM.  Sounds like they will be different heights and neither is Aluminum?  If so, the salesman failed high school Chemistry and Geometry.  The galvanized wire has a coating of Zinc applied to it which makes it unreactive.

I say go for it.



Edited by huntseat 2007-04-30 12:56 PM
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-05-01 8:33 AM (#60236 - in reply to #60191)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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That is not how I understand galvanic corrosion. How I understand it is that two electrochemically dissimilar metals have to be electrically connected. Copper and galvanized/zinc-plated steel are certainly dissimilar and being a hot wire fence, they will certainly be electrically connected. My understanding is that the copper is the more cathodic/noble metal, and the zinc-plated steel is the more anodic/corrosion prone metal.

But, does the zinc resist corrosion, making the problem non-existent? Or, is the fence dealer right and I will have a problem?
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huntseat
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2007-05-01 4:38 PM (#60267 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Are you not going to use them on two different strands?  Why would you put both metals together?

It is quite possible I've got the wrong mental image of the fence you'll be building.  I imagine the top strand(chest high)to be one metal then down the fence the middle strand(knee high)is another metal.  If so then they shouldn't touch.  Right?

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-05-01 5:00 PM (#60269 - in reply to #60267)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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huntseat, you are invisioning my fence the same way I am invisioning it. The strands will not touch in the middle of a run, but they are all electrically connected to the fence charger and all electrically connected at gates and such.
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huntseat
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2007-05-02 7:49 AM (#60292 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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Great news!  Then all you need to do is find a great conductive material for the connections.  Know your material and find yourself an electrical supply house.  Those boys can tell you exactly what material will work for both metals, then just use it for the connections and problem solved.

It's also nice to know I can still READ!

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-05-02 12:50 PM (#60307 - in reply to #60292)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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huntseat, do you mean a wire made out of the right material, that can be used to connect all the powered strands at gates and other connections?

The Electrobraid dealer mentioned using a stainless steel block at each connection. I have searched for something like this on the internet, but have come up with nothing. The closest thing I have found is a galvanic isolator that people use on boats when they are using electricity from land.

Okay, now this gets even more confusing. The EnduraSoft product from Premier1 has both tinned copper and stainless steel strands within it. http://www.premier1supplies.com/detail.php?prod_id=17857&cat_id=41 Whadya think of them apples?
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Rich M.
Reg. Sep 2005
Posted 2007-05-03 7:27 AM (#60345 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions


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JD, use copper wire for your jumper between the strands. On the electrobraid end use the split bolt connectors they supply / sell. On the other end you will use the same style of connector, but make sure it is marked AL/CU,they can be found at Home Depot/ Lowes/ or an electric supply store and will be likely silver in color. They can contact both materials without corrosion, the connector will have a flat piece in it to separate the copper jumper wire from the dissimilar strand.Just a personal note, I feel smooth wire, high tensile or not, has no place around horses. The leg injuries can be horrific ( wife works for an equine vet, have seen first hand) often ending in euthanasia or loss of use of the horse. The extra you shell out now for the extra electrobraid strands is far less than vet bills or heartache of loss. Rich.
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-05-03 8:14 AM (#60347 - in reply to #60345)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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Rich, thanks for the heads up on the special split bolt connectors.

Originally written by Rich M. on 2007-05-03 7:27 AM

The extra you shell out now for the extra electrobraid strands is far less than vet bills or heartache of loss.

I understand what you are trying to tell me, and it is something I have went back and forth on in my head many times.  I still have not made the final decision on what type of fence to go with.  I appreciate the comments.

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2007-05-03 4:42 PM (#60374 - in reply to #57929)
Subject: RE: Fence Building Questions



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I see now on ElectroBraid's website that they sell those special split bolt connectors.  They call them neutral plate connectors.  Are they $6.75 each everywhere?  I will have to check out the hardware store or home improvement place.
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