Posted 2005-04-29 7:45 PM (#24507) Subject: Hard starting truck
Regular
Posts: 98 Location: Baldwin City, KS 66006
Mr. Truck....I own a 94 Ford 3/4 ton auto, 4x4 turbo diesel w/about 140,000 miles on it. I put a new starter on it last year, glow plugs were checked 8 months ago and they said they were fine and the batteries give alot of juice to the starter (is not sluggish at all) however, if it sits long enough for the engine to cool clear down I have to turn the engine over about 5 times ...turn off key....turn on key....pump gas...turn engine over again about 5 times....foot to the floor and then it will start. I always wait for the glow plugs to warm up before hitting the starter the first time. Any ideas..someone thought maybe the fuel pump was getting weak. Runs fine once it gets going. Sometimes idles pretty rough in the beginning though.
Posted 2005-04-29 8:20 PM (#24509 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 565 Location: Michigan
This sounds alot like a problem we had with our '00 Chevy Silverado, gasser. It would do the same thing to try and start it, then once it did, just chugged and you kind of had to rev it. Turned out to be a bad fuel pressure sensor, and bingo, she was cured! Not saying this is your truck's problem but your description sounded familiar.
Well, once Mr.Truck gets done test driving trucks thru the Rockies, he should have an answer for ya!
Posted 2005-04-29 8:29 PM (#24513 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Expert
Posts: 2689
Originally written by ISHOM on 2005-04-29 7:45 PM
Mr. Truck....I own a 94 Ford 3/4 ton auto, 4x4 turbo diesel w/about 140,000 miles on it. I put a new starter on it last year, glow plugs were checked 8 months ago and they said they were fine and the batteries give alot of juice to the starter (is not sluggish at all) however, if it sits long enough for the engine to cool clear down I have to turn the engine over about 5 times ...turn off key....turn on key....pump gas...turn engine over again about 5 times....foot to the floor and then it will start. I always wait for the glow plugs to warm up before hitting the starter the first time. Any ideas..someone thought maybe the fuel pump was getting weak. Runs fine once it gets going. Sometimes idles pretty rough in the beginning though.
Check for leaks. It sounds to me like the fuel is leaking back to the tank. Any wet spots under it ?
Quit pumping it, it doesn't do anything useful and is probably masking some symptoms. Will it ever start AT ALL if you absolutely don't pump it ?
BTW, this is really a truck question and belongs in a truck forum. We know a bit about horses and trailers here, but we only USE trucks. There are EXPERTS in the truck forums and pointers to those forums are scattered throughout this forum.
Posted 2005-04-29 10:13 PM (#24518 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
New User
Posts: 1
Location: port huron mi
I have a 2003 f-350 that sounds like I have the same problem with mine so I took mine to the dealership and they had it for 2 weeks trying to find out what was wrong with it they finally called down to detroit and they are sending down an engineer on monday to look at it as soon as i know something i will let you know
Posted 2005-04-30 1:24 AM (#24521 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 304
When was last time you changed fuel fliter? or cleaned pressure regulator screen? If either of these are dirty it would restrict fuel to the injectors.
Kinda sounds like the GPR (glow plug relay) to me. Do you hear it "click" on while waiting on the WTS light?
A good way to determine if glow plugs are working is to watch your volt gage. When you turn key on and Wait To Start, the needle should go way over to discharge and stay there for up to two mins (depending on how cold it is), even after your engine starts. Have you tried plugging it in for a couple hours before trying to start? If that helps then you have glow plug problem.
Seach this form, and if you can't find answer post a question:
Posted 2005-04-30 7:43 AM (#24525 - in reply to #24521) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Expert
Posts: 2689
Originally written by rockyrider on 2005-04-30 1:24 AM
When was last time you changed fuel fliter? or cleaned pressure regulator screen? If either of these are dirty it would restrict fuel to the injectors.
Kinda sounds like the GPR (glow plug relay) to me. Do you hear it "click" on while waiting on the WTS light?
A good way to determine if glow plugs are working is to watch your volt gage. When you turn key on and Wait To Start, the needle should go way over to discharge and stay there for up to two mins (depending on how cold it is), even after your engine starts. Have you tried plugging it in for a couple hours before trying to start? If that helps then you have glow plug problem.
Seach this form, and if you can't find answer post a question:
I'll second most of that.
Fuel and air filters ESPECIALLY !!!
Also, the current required for 8 glow plugs is too much for a single relay in some designs, that is to say they find it easier/simpler/cheaper to use one relay for half the cylinders and one for the other half. You may have good glow plugs, with only half of them getting current.
Another thing worth remembering is that (by definition) diesel engines are compression ignition engines, the heat generated by compressing the fuel/air mixture is what causes combustion. Even when the mixture doesn't ignite you are still warming the engine up by cranking it over the 5 or 6 times. This could be masking a glow plug circuit problem, i.e. on your 2nd or 3rd attempt you are actually cranking a warm/warm'ish engine, at least in the cylinder heads where the combustion happens.
SOME diesels also have a cold start injector, it is possible that your's isn't functioning. There is NO accelerator pump on any recent or current designs as far as I know.
Anyway, this is REALLY a truck issue and the F*RD truck forums are the best places to get answers to it.
Posted 2005-05-03 1:06 AM (#24615 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1160 Location: Denver Colorado
Sorry so slow, had to move wife #2 out this weekend. I've got to start writing their names down. It does sound like glow plugs or relays. Your year truck has a relay for each side. In 2003 6.0L PS went to one control for all eight. When you replace glow plugs, you need to also replace the relay. 140,000 miles is alot on factory glow plugs. If it were a tractor, I say to shoot ether (starting fluid) in the air filter to see if it starts better. Then you'd know if the glow plugs are heating up. 94 could be pre Power Stroke with a pre-combustion chamer and is harder to start if glow plugs are weak, vrs. 94.5 Power Stroke direct injection. It's not hard to relace glow plugs and relays. Go to Auto Zone get the Chiltons $15 manual, probably a good idea to buy Ford glow plugs and relays though. I think all the pumping you're doing is making the truck idle rough at the beginning.
Posted 2005-05-03 7:56 AM (#24623 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Elite Veteran
Posts: 602 Location: md
I'm just starting to have this problem. 1997 F350 with 60 some K. 7.3. If I plug it in it starts. But below 40degrees with out being plugged in==forget it. It seems to start better in neutral also. How many glow plugs does this truck have? Thanks.
Posted 2005-05-03 1:28 PM (#24651 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1160 Location: Denver Colorado
You have eight glow plugs and 2 relays, does it help to cycle the glow plugs twice ? (turn the key on until the glow plug indicator light goes out, turn off the key and do it again.) You Dodge folk stop laughing. Just because you have an intake manifold heater and don't have to worry about glow plugs. Duramax has both. Most salespeople don't explain much about using glow plugs when you buy a new truck. But to get the longest life from them, you need to be sure the glow plug indicator light on the dash goes out before you start the engine. If not the tip of the glow plug is red hot in top of the cylinder and when your truck starts exploding diesel and it will shorten plug life.
Posted 2005-10-26 10:07 PM (#32391 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Veteran
Posts: 254 Location: Dickinson, TX
How is your glow plug controller? How are the connections?Are you getting air in the lines (when was the last time your injector lines were replaced? If you don't know, then they probably need replacing). Any symptoms of air in the lines (besides hard starting? i.e., a raspy noise when the engine first starts, or stalling soon after start?)My truck has a similar problem--not nearly as bad as yours (it'll start on the first crank after about 2 seconds instead of instantaneously like it did before the lines started leaking air).I'd suggest you check your glow plug controller (aka glow plug relay). Your wait to start light should be on for 8-10 seconds, MINIMUM if your glowplugs are all working. If they're not all working, you'll have problems like you're having. Better get to the bottom of this before you lose your batteries and starter.Check out http://www.thedieselstop.com for LOTS of helpful information. Is your truck a factory turbo?Don't let anyone steer you wrong. These FORD trucks are Awesome, especially in the body style you and I have. My '91 has 200,000 (probably 218,000 actual) miles on the clock and I love it aside from the weak performance of the 15 year-old IDI engine (no problem--I'm having a new Cummins put into the truck in March--less than 1/3 the price of a new truck and the same performance).Mike
Posted 2005-10-27 2:36 AM (#32396 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Regular
Posts: 83 Location: Cheshire England
what comes out of the tail pipe when you try to start it? If your glow plugs aren't working corectly you can get unburnt diesel/white vapour before it builds up enough heat from compresion to get it started, if nothing comes out until it fires up that would indicate lack of fuel! the other post about an air leak in the fuel line sounds posible, that allows the pump to lose its prime and then it takes some cranking to push air out and get presure up to the injectors!! could account for the rough running on starting too.you may need to presurise.the fuel tank slightly to see if you can find a leak hope this helps...
Posted 2005-10-27 8:57 AM (#32399 - in reply to #24507) Subject: RE: Hard starting truck
Member
Posts: 16
I have similar problems with my 1995 F-250. It's had all the glowplugs checked, new starter, many glow plug relays, and all the filters changed out religiously.
One big truck mechanic who worked on it said that it was possible the glowplug wiring harness was bad. That's an expensive repair, so I just keep mine plugged in when the temperature is under about 45.
Hard starting truck
I'm just starting to have this problem. 1997 F350 with 60 some K. 7.3. If I plug it in it starts. But below 40degrees with out being plugged in==forget it. It seems to start better in neutral also. How many glow plugs does this truck have? Thanks.
