Posted 2008-02-02 12:16 AM (#75856) Subject: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 1
Location: Wisconsin
Hoping for some advice - I recently bought a 3 horse bumper pull trailer with a small dressing room. I am pulling with a Suburban. Love the trailer - it's Shadow, no complaints at all. What's the problem? :)
I go on weekend camping trips every 2nd or 3rd weekend from March to October - endurance riding.
I'm looking for advice/products to make my weekend camping trips a bit more civilized.
Initially, I tried sleeping in the suburban - not fun and can be very cold. I have a cot and a rug that I plan to put on the floor of the horse area after it has been swept out.
I had thought about converting the dressing area to a small living quarters, but haven't found a lot of info on this online.
I have several questions -
would love to have power to have lights, coffeemaker inside the trailer. I do have inside lights in the horse area. Is it possible to power other things off an auxiliary battery perhaps?
Biggest issue - heat. I live in the midwest and the spring/fall rides can be very chilly. I have a Mr. Buddy - that didn't seem to be able to handle the cold. Trailer inside area is probably too large for the Mr. Buddy. I am thinking about a generator - other ideas?
Would love to hear any ideas on equipment, modifications to make the next ride season more comfy!
Posted 2008-02-02 3:08 AM (#75858 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 296
Location: Tennessee
Kerosene heater. I have an Aladdin with a similar design to the one in the link and love it. A tank of fuel lasts about 10 hours. It will keep a 200 sf room toasty.
Posted 2008-02-02 5:21 AM (#75864 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 270
Location: Roanoke IL
Get a porta potty to stick in the horse compartment, I second the 12v. coffee pot, and if you're looking at a generator you will probably want to go with something like an onan if you want to save your eardrums. Personally, I'd save the $2000 and just get battery/propane powered things. The cot would be a good idea to keep you off the cold floor.
BTW, I'm a fellow Illinois-dweller. I'm around peoria. I know what you mean about spring & fall...but at this point I'm ready for anything above 40 degrees!
Posted 2008-02-02 11:44 AM (#75881 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 5870
Location: western PA
Any heater that uses a fuel can be dangerous in a closed area, particularly those that are unvented. There was a thread about the deaths of a family camping just last summer. If fuels are used, be sure to follow the usual precautions of adequate ventilation, and purchase a CO and smoke detector.
There are many 12v appliances available, but don't hook them all up to your lighting circuit. It would be better to wire another circuit off your battery with its own breaker/fuse to power the new appliances.
I would also make sure that I was running all of this electrical load off a battery separate from your Suburban. Any one of the appliances or even the lighting can drain a battery. You will always want an ability to start your vehicle.
Primitive camping for me is a full LQ with a broken tv.
Posted 2008-02-02 7:10 PM (#75901 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 391
Location: Columbia, KY
I started doing CTR's then endurance riding back in the mid 80's when "primitive camping" was the only kind of camping! How things have changed...
A couple friends used to sweep out their trailers then sleep in them. you can make it very cosy with blankets on the walls, table, etc. I think in that sitation a generator is more trouble than it's worth.
I have a small heater/cooker contraption that came from Cabellas. it's very handy and runs off of the small propane bottles. I'd turn it on at nite to take the chill off then get into the sleeping bag, first thing in the morning turn it on and while it was warming the trailer also use it to heat hot water for hot chocolate or instant coffee. it's very stable, it will hang from a hook or whatever and also can be turned on it's back to use as a heating burner. it only cost around $30.
Posted 2008-02-02 7:50 PM (#75904 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 164
Location: Delaware
I would get a 12V electric blanket and a power box. I have seen them in Cabellas and JC Whitney for sale. Probably around $30. The power box I have is a 1000W from Sam's for around $49. I have a propane stove and heat water for whatever I need. You could make instant coffee or cowboy brew on the stove. My friend sleeps in her 2 horse that has a walkway to the dressing room. She started with an air mattress but upgraded to the Coleman cot. Her porta potti is on the other side of the divider. She uses a Buddy heater to heat up in there and shuts it off when she goes to bed. To keep the trailer warm you can hang something on the interior sides (canvas tarp, blankets, old drapes) this will keep your heat in better.
Posted 2008-02-02 7:54 PM (#75905 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 164
Location: Delaware
Another thing. Honda makes a 2000W inverter generator that is perfect for camping. It is super quiet and new is under $1000. You can find used on Ebay or check for trade-ins at a Honda shop. This would run your coffee pot and electric heater (but not together).
Posted 2008-02-03 6:39 AM (#75925 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 10
I also have 2 hrs bumper pull and do alot of primitative camping. I live in Michigan, sometimes it gets really cold. If you get a cot get a aluminium spring cot with a good thick foam mattress. No poles in your sides. Helps with keeping the cold air from coming up underneath. Colemen carries these. You can buy sleeping bag warmers also, these are like the hand warmers. I have wore socks and put the hand warmers in my bag. Make sure you get sleeping bag rated for below zero. Wear a hat to bed, you loose alot of heat from your head. I have a propane stove that I make coffee on with a metal coffee pot, best tasting coffee. I also own a zodi propane shower, best invention ever made :) I have the twin tank one and heats the water up fast, I usually turn one tank off cause it gets to hot. These showers save water too!
Posted 2008-02-03 6:57 AM (#75927 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 93
Location: Southern Indiana
I would sell both the bumper pull and suburban for a truck with a gooseneck style living quarters. A gooseneck living quarters can provide the bed area in the gooseneck area with any size living quarters your needs desire. You can spend as little or as much as possible. Please be careful of heating devices. On page 25 of the February NRHA reiner magazine mentions the deaths of a family resulting from CO poisoning from the use of a propane heater.........Carbon Monoxide detectors can be life saving. My point is--buy a RVIA certified living quarters that fits your needs........What is your life worth while you camp??? Please help the economy and BUY BUY BUY!!!!!!! You will not have any problems trading around from your current trailer and tow vehicle.........BEST OF LUCK and have fun!!! Paul
Posted 2008-02-03 11:00 AM (#75937 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 151
Location: Manitoba, Canada
I used to have a bumper pull trailer with no tack space. My daughter and I took 3 horses for a week long trip, and piled it really deep with straw. At each stop we cleaned out the manure and wet straw and fluffed the rest. I slid plywood into the window slots to close them up, leaving just a small air gap on one of them. We inflated an air mattress and put it on top of the straw, then put our little pop up tent on top of the air mattress, with the tent door facing the escape door at the front of the trailer. We could hop in the trailer through the escape door and we had a space with our coolers and a couple of lawn chairs where we could eat or get dressed, and then scoot into the tent to sleep. We put my husbands down-filled sleeping bag under us, and a cheapo sleeping bag on top. We slept with our bare feet hanging out and the blankets kicked part way off, nice and toasty, while everyone else on the trip complained about how they froze. Just keep in mind that if you sleep on an air mattress, you need good insulation between it and you - it's like sleeping on ice if all you have is a sheet under you.
Posted 2008-02-03 4:26 PM (#75957 - in reply to #75927) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 2828
Location: Southern New Mexico
Originally written by coltaffyjo on 2008-02-03 6:57 PM
I would sell both the bumper pull and suburban for a truck with a gooseneck style living quarters. A gooseneck living quarters can provide the bed area in the gooseneck area with any size living quarters your needs desire. You can spend as little or as much as possible. Please be careful of heating devices. On page 25 of the February NRHA reiner magazine mentions the deaths of a family resulting from CO poisoning from the use of a propane heater.........Carbon Monoxide detectors can be life saving. My point is--buy a RVIA certified living quarters that fits your needs........What is your life worth while you camp??? Please help the economy and BUY BUY BUY!!!!!!! You will not have any problems trading around from your current trailer and tow vehicle.........BEST OF LUCK and have fun!!! Paul
As much as everyone would love to do that. It isn't practical and not everyone needs or wants a big truck and trailer. And not everyone can afford it.
Posted 2008-02-03 4:50 PM (#75960 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 164
Location: Delaware
I agree with you Terri. Not everyone can afford a LQ with today's economics. I have a goosneck stock with a dressing room converted to dry LQ. It's paid for and I can't justify taking out a loan for something that will sit more than use. You make do with what you can afford. I have seen alot of people set up in their bumper pulls or stock trailers. They have just as good a time as the $40,000 rigs when riding. I have also seen quite a few rigs sitting for sale because the owners couldn't afford them after they took out the loan for the $50k+ trailers. Arabrider, you will probably have the best memories in your trailer setting it up as a cozy little nest then most riders in their "big rigs".
Posted 2008-02-04 3:08 PM (#76050 - in reply to #75956) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 39
Location: Haslet Tx
I was just looking at zodis web site. It said tent heaters no longer available ,all of them. I had never saw these heaters b4. I wonder if there is a problem with them? Does any one know? Its a great idea though.
Posted 2008-02-04 3:27 PM (#76052 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 62
Location: Western Wisconsin
Have you considered maybe going the route of a pickup camper & truck instead of a Suburban? You can pick up nice used ones for quite reasonable, and you would have heat, water, fridge & stove AND a dry place to sleep (all without electric hookups if they are not available.) You can still use your BP trailer & will be able get in & out of campsites quite easily.
And I too will caution about using portable heaters in unvented areas - just this past fall 4 people at a Clydesdale show north of Madison lost their lives to CO...
Posted 2008-02-04 3:57 PM (#76054 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 296
Location: Tennessee
Always good to use caution with heaters of any kind. Even electric ones in your house. My neighbor burned his house down with an electric wall heater. He never used it, it so he cut the circuit breaker for it and put a couch in front of it. One day another breaker tripped, he went to box, "reset" the breaker for the heater by mistake and then left for work.
The kerosene heater I recommended earlier in this thread (which is what probably generated the repeated death warnings) is a very safe, easy to use, economical heater that would work great in the OP's horse trailer. It was designed to be used indoors in enclosed spaces and burns very clean. My wife and I used ours as our primary heat source for many years. Many, many nights we ran it all night in our <100 sf bedroom, sometimes with the door shut when it got really cold (cheap '40s era duplex with no insulation, LOL). It regularly burned out before I woke to refill it, which you can do while it's running, btw...fuel tank removes from unit. I'm sure it must have put out a little CO as it died down, but nowhere near enough to kill us, obviously. When these heaters run out of kerosene, they go from full efficiency burning to out cold in about 15 minutes. If you knock into it, it shuts off.
Still, anything can happen. A CO detector is cheap insurance. Stay warm. Sleep well.
Posted 2008-02-04 4:39 PM (#76058 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 2453
Location: Northern Utah
I spent many a night in the front of my bare gooseneck at CTR rides. I've spent many a night sleeping in a wall tent while hunting. I spent a lot of nights hunting and fishing sleeping under the shell on my pick up bed.
Get a good sleeping bag. Don't use the heaters unless you are awake.
I used to warm up the area before going to sleep. Turn of the Mr Buddy Heater, Wake up in the morning and turn it on as I got up. I spent a lot of nights at 15*-18* and slept just fine.
A Colman stove to cook on.
If you sleep in the back of the trailer or a tent. Get a cot and put a good pad on it to insulate you from cold underneath.
As mentioned get a small generator. Honda, Yamaha and the Chinese knock offs all offer small 1000 or 2000 watt generators. I dragged a 2000 watt generator along for years. It will run a small microwave to warm up soup/chili/oatmeal or a danish. I still keep a George Foreman grill in my trailers. Plug it into the generator and It can cook a hot dog, hamburger, pork chop, chicken breast, salmon portion faster with that, than it takes to get out and set up the coleman stove.
I just use the Generators to cook food, provide lights and recharge the battery. Not to produce heat.
I saw some folks place a tarp around the Gooseneck of stock trailer. Inside that enclosed area, they put their Porta Potty. Private and far enough away from their bed so they didn't smell it.
And of course you can set up a nice tent, install a wood burning camp stove, stock it up good with wood and go to bed.
Posted 2008-02-04 7:06 PM (#76062 - in reply to #75856) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 93
Location: Southern Indiana
Let's do a search on HTW for a weekender LQ. Bet they are not 40 to 50 thousand. THe person that posted this thread would enjoy her 2 to 3 weekends a month in her trailer over a tent. hands down. Making coffee in a tent over an outside fire versus plug and brew?? He/She already mentioned external power( I am sensing generator) And with today's creative financing, the payments would be very affordable. A trailer of this size would not require a Big truck. At the Congress , Lakota had very nice LQ's in bumper pull trailers. Let's face it-- Owning horses is not cheap--- Half of the fun is all the extras you get to buy!!!! Unfortunately, you may have to pay for a little convenience but won't regret the purchase once you are in a rain storm in your tent..............My family decided to sell our LQ's and go the route of Hotel rooms.......go figure.............
Posted 2008-02-04 10:47 PM (#76090 - in reply to #76085) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 216
Location: Chillicothe, Ohio
All good posts. For heat, there are a lot of options, but when you dont have hookups or want to annoy me with your generator one of the best and safest propane heaters is the small catalytic heaters made by Olympian...I'm not a salesperson, but I did my research. A cat heater burns much cleaner than any other type of heater and releases much less fumes and co2 and these us no electricity. All the posts are correct about the dangers of using any heater that burns fuel inside your trailer. With the small olympian, I crack a ceiling vent 1/2" and open the trailer door window 1/2". I have often operated this heater all night and will continue to do so based on researching these heaters on the internet. There are a lot of RV'ers using them. Install a good co2 monitor and smoke detector and ensure you dont have any combustables where they could fall etc. If nothing else use the heater to warm up your space for a couple hours before you turn in. With an insulated lq and a good goosedown spread, you'll sleep like a baby. Get your spouse to crawl out and turn on the heater before you crawl out and you'll be warm in the morning!
Posted 2008-02-05 12:17 AM (#76098 - in reply to #76050) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 2828
Location: Southern New Mexico
Originally written by Collin on 2008-02-04 3:08 AM
I was just looking at zodis web site. It said tent heaters no longer available ,all of them. I had never saw these heaters b4. I wonder if there is a problem with them? Does any one know? Its a great idea though.
I emailed them and they said they were out of stock. After googleing them everyone that I checked said they were out of stock too. I'd love to get one for my small DR.
Posted 2008-02-05 4:22 PM (#76138 - in reply to #76098) Subject: RE: primitive camping suggestions
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Posts: 216
Location: Chillicothe, Ohio
We'll Gard...I am the spouse that always gets up and turns on the heater...plus cooks the breakfast. But I'm not complaining...my wife got us started into these horses, now the both us and the 2 kids have been into it for a few years. Kids barrel race, county fair 4h, and we do a lot of camping/trailriding. Having a spouse that wants to do these things is worth getting up early, turning on the heater and cooking her breakfast.