Posted 2007-03-24 12:47 PM (#57681) Subject: Maryland and the CDL
Elite Veteran
Posts: 602 Location: md
There are new rumors abounding in MD that anyone that pulls a trailer will have to have a CDL. I know lots of folks here are from Md. What have you heard? Personally I think it is just a rumour, but you never know??
Posted 2007-03-24 9:58 PM (#57722 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Veteran
Posts: 235 Location: Keymar,Maryland
Nothing on this end. Not even the rumors. Seems impractical, I would need a cdl to haul my garbage to the dump on a 5x8 trailer. Then again MD is creative. We have the tax to take a dump ( flush tax)!. Rich
Posted 2007-03-25 12:02 AM (#57727 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Veteran
Posts: 201 Location: Lincoln, NE
Just read an article in the newspaper today about a workshop being taught by Nebraska State Patrol on the new rules which apply to truckers, farmers, etc, anyone driving a rig that weighs over 10,000 lbs. Sorry don't know all the specifics and if a CDL will be required.
Thought maybe it would be a good idea to attend. My half ton pickup plus a two horse slant load gooseneck already weighs almost 8,000 lbs w/out the horses.
Posted 2007-03-25 11:21 AM (#57745 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Veteran
Posts: 121 Location: MO
This has been a hot topic around the training barn where I keep my horse, and apparently is affecting more than the state of Maryland.
A lot of trainers that haul several horses have upgraded their rigs to a tractor-trailer setup. Because of the size, they need a CDL. Others that haul several horses and still pull with a one ton or greater are being pulled over simply because of the graphics on their truck and/or trailer. They are now considered to be commercial haulers because they are advertising their business and make their living by hauling horses. Apparently, laws have changed and officials are cracking down. Sting operations are being done where they are pulling over people leaving show grounds.
There was an article about this very thing in the Jan or Feb issue of one of the magazines I get. Sorry, but I can't remember which one. It was either AQHA Journal, America's Horse, or Horse & Rider.
Posted 2007-03-25 12:15 PM (#57750 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Member
Posts: 28 Location: Portage, IN
I look at it this way.
CDLs are not that hard to get, given you have to study for it and tast more tests, but it will make you a safer more educated driver. With the CDL you can also fall back on it for driving jobs with companies. And if a need arises, and someone needs to move a large truck, and you a comfortable driving it, and know how, you are able to with out being limited to a regualr license.
I think it may be a good idea, you may have to pay a little more for it, licenses are usually free, but to have a new one sent to you with the new endorsement is usually anywhere from 5-30 bucks, at least here in CA.
In the long run, even if you are only hauling horses, you butt will be covered, and you have the ability to use it if you ever have to.
Posted 2007-03-25 1:38 PM (#57752 - in reply to #57750) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Expert
Posts: 2828 Location: Southern New Mexico
It's a good idea in THEORY. But when I went and asked about it at the DMV where we used to live, I was told that you test in the vehicle you will be driving, and then further down the discussion I was told it had to be a commercial vehicle. You couldn't test in a private vehicle. I'm not driving for a business, I'm driving for myself.
So if they try to require me to have a CDL they will have to change some rules so I can get one.
Posted 2007-03-25 5:40 PM (#57760 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Veteran
Posts: 164 Location: Delaware
My brother-in-law got stopped in Salisbury about a month ago. They pulled him over with a 12' enclosed trailer. He was told anything with 2 axles has to go thru the weigh station. Now he was pulling with a half ton Chevy. By the time they were done with him he had a $250 fine for safety chains not hooked properly (breakaway wire has to be doubled and hooked back to itself?) & a $500 for not stopping at the station. He asked about horsetrailers and they told him the same thing applies. Anything more than one axle has to stop when the station is open. Also I heard if you put any farm logos on the truck or trailer it is considered commercial.
Posted 2007-03-25 6:35 PM (#57763 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: how to get there with a trailer????
Member
Posts: 22
Location: Webster, NH
This is a common question, and seems to go through different states at different times. Here goes the brief explanation:
If you are driving a private vehicle, none of the CDL stuff applies. It is only commercial drivers. DOT (Department of Transportation) basically defines commercial as anyone who makes money, in any way, as a result of driving. If you drive to a show, and earn prize money, that is commercial. Farm name on truck or trailer = commercial.
If the combination of your truck and trailer maximum load rating exceeds 26,000# and you are commercial, you need a CDL-A. If you weigh more than 10,000# and are commecial, you need to maintain a log, have a medical card, and a vehicle inspection report. Your vehicle must also pass a DOT inspection which includes a fire extinguisher (sp?) and flares. You exceed 10,000# with a pickup and trailer.
This is the law in all fifty states. You can find additional information through your state's department of transportation.
Weigh stations are different from CDLs. You need to read the sign. If the sign says 5 tons and above, you pull in, whether you're commercial or not. The signs will tell you whether you need to worry. If in doubt, stop. If you're not sure you're legal, go down to your State's DOT and ask them to check, although any garage that does DOT inspecitions should also be able to tell you.
Posted 2007-03-25 7:32 PM (#57765 - in reply to #57763) Subject: RE: how to get there with a trailer????
Expert
Posts: 2828 Location: Southern New Mexico
You exceed 10,000# with a pickup and trailer.
That's where the problem lies. Non commercial vehicles that exceede the 10,000# mark. There are places/officers that expect you to have a CDL with a vehicle/combo that size but no way to get one unless you ARE a commerical driver. I am not paying to go to school to drive a rig I'll never drive so I can get a CDL.
Posted 2007-03-25 8:38 PM (#57769 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Member
Posts: 22
Location: Webster, NH
Maybe I can explain this a different way. If you are commercial (farm name on trailer will do it) you have one set of laws. If you are a recreational vehicle, there are a different set of laws. Recreational vehicles include motor homes and travel trailers. The large motor homes and travel trailers exceed 40,000#. They do not, however, require a CDL. I believe that Maryland is discussing changing that rule, but has not done so yet. It will face a considerable challange from the RV industry, which has lots of money. There is no way they want to require these 60-year-olds to have to get a special license. And guess who buys these big RVs. If you are recreational (no farm name on truck, no commercial purpose), you are required to have the same license as someone hauling a travel trailer. And if someone can show me a state that requires a CDL for a travel trailer, I'll probably die of shock.Some states (New York, New Jersey, and Maine) require that vehicles over a certain weight (which includes pickups) have to have a commercial registration. THIS DOES NOT MAKE THEM COMMERCIAL VEHICLES. You'll see numerous travel trailers registered that way.In all of this, the best people to talk to are your state's Department of Transportation. They know the rules that apply to your state. Tell them exactly what you're hauling (they'll want to know axle number and total weight capacity) and find out what they say.Jim Clark-Dawe
Posted 2007-03-26 4:41 PM (#57825 - in reply to #57745) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Regular
Posts: 88 Location: Youngstown, OH
Yes, there have been several articles on this topic published recently. I know I have spent countless hours trying to figure out if this effects me here in OH. I've spoken to the State Highway Patrol, the PUCO and several other departments. Basically, the SHP has told me that it really just depends on which cop pulls you over and how you answer some questions.
If you personally own the truck & trailer, and there are no graphics relating to sponsors or a business, you should be OK. But if you tell them you are headed to a horse show, even a 4-H show, that your ability to potentially win a trophy could be considered by some as "renumeration" and then you would be deemed to be "commercial".
The two officers that I spoke to said that the best response is "I'm going trail riding at my uncle's house!". Of course the size of your rig can set off alarms too. Pretty much depends on the day and who pulls you over - near as I can tell.
Posted 2007-03-26 5:27 PM (#57829 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Location: Texas
In Texas a lot of folks put "Farm" tags on their horse trailers. The implication is that it is used for farm related business. Weight can then require a CDL, since you have Farm tags, even if you are hauling for pleasure.
Posted 2007-03-26 5:29 PM (#57830 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Expert
Posts: 2828 Location: Southern New Mexico
There was a post on here awhile back about a guy in FLA that got a ticket for no CDL while driving a 1ton with a 5th wheel. They said it was because his truck was over 10,000lbs. It was before I came up to NM the first time so I guess it's been 2 years or so.
Posted 2007-03-26 8:46 PM (#57855 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Member
Posts: 21
Location: Smyrna, DE
Last month at the PA horse expo they had a representative from Penn Dot give a presentation on what the PA laws are. He basically said that the PA DOT has become keen to the situation of horse trailers and how they are used. The rules for non - CDL are:
GROSS COMBINED REGISTERED WEIGHT must not exceed 26,000 pounds. For example, my F250 has a 10,000 registered Gross Vehicle Weight. My Trailer has a Gross Vehicle Weight of 14,000 pounds. The sum of the gross weights is less than 26000 pounds. Therefore, I do not need a CDL. However, if I had a huge living quarters trailer with a GVW of 16,000 I will need a CDL. Also, you can register your trailer for any weight,however, if you are weighed and are ound to be overweight for your registration, you are basically screwed.
For trailers over 10,000 pounds, you need a US DOT number (this is free from the FMCSA website). In addition, you need a DOT inspection and a medical card as well as a fire extinguisher and marker triangles.
Plus, you need to pull into any open weigh station. Argue all you want, but if you take your truck or trailer off on your taxes you are a business.
Posted 2007-03-26 10:40 PM (#57859 - in reply to #57855) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Expert
Posts: 1871 Location: NY
I was told to pull in to a weigh station if it is open and let the people decid if you should stay or go. I read on the fed rule for driving site that for priveta use and pleasure you do not need a C D L . so if you are moving a friend horse and you get pull over the cope will ask'' is the horse yours.'' the truck and trailer and the horse should be owned by the driver or passage in the truck. this whole thing is for more money and it makes me sick I just what to ride
Posted 2007-03-27 1:36 AM (#57862 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Member
Posts: 28 Location: Portage, IN
I think there is also another way around it. Most people put "PRIVATE - NOT FOR HIRE" in small letters on the doors of their vehicle, and also on trailers. If the truck is marked with NOT FOR HIRE then it shows it is not commerical and used for private business. EVEN if it lists their company name on the vehicle. It is to show that it is not for hire, but even with a company name on it, it does not matter, you are allowed to put what ever you want on your vehicle, its called free speech.
If I get pulled over when I go to MO, driving a F-150 with a BP 2H, I am in Law Enforcement and will call the officer on it. It is a private vehicle, with a private trailer, and not used for business. I also will not go through any weigh stations, it is not legal here in CA for a pick-up to go through a weigh station, so they can not ticket me in another state if I am not allowed to go through weigh stations in my home state, after all I know the laws in MY state not others.
Posted 2007-03-27 6:36 AM (#57866 - in reply to #57862) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Member
Posts: 22
Location: Webster, NH
Originally written by PTRJason on 2007-03-27 1:36 AM
I think there is also another way around it. Most people put "PRIVATE - NOT FOR HIRE" in small letters on the doors of their vehicle, and also on trailers. If the truck is marked with NOT FOR HIRE then it shows it is not commerical and used for private business. EVEN if it lists their company name on the vehicle. It is to show that it is not for hire, but even with a company name on it, it does not matter, you are allowed to put what ever you want on your vehicle, its called free speech.
If I get pulled over when I go to MO, driving a F-150 with a BP 2H, I am in Law Enforcement and will call the officer on it. It is a private vehicle, with a private trailer, and not used for business. I also will not go through any weigh stations, it is not legal here in CA for a pick-up to go through a weigh station, so they can not ticket me in another state if I am not allowed to go through weigh stations in my home state, after all I know the laws in MY state not others.
No, no, no.
Marking a truck "Not for hire" does not make it non-commercial. Right at the moment I'm in Bristol and have been seeing all the NASCAR haulers leaving the race and heading to the next. Most are marked "not for hire." You really want to try to argue that they are not commercial? If you do, I want to watch the state trooper hearing it. It will provide him or her with some great entertainment.
What "not for hire" means is that the truck is not a common carrier. This means that the trucker does not need to carry liability insurance on its cargo and some other regulatory advantages.
weight stations are to each state's specific specifications. You need to follow each state's specific requirements. If you try running by Arizona's weight stations, you'll probably see blue lights in your mirror as I believe Arizona requires all livestock to stop, whether commercial or not. weight stations explain their requirements in their posted signs. You have to follow them, regardless of what state your truck is registered in. If you blow by a weight station, not only is there a fine for that, but they will start checking everything else on your truck. Going through the weight station is usually a wave as you drive through.
Posted 2007-03-27 6:55 AM (#57867 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Expert
Posts: 1283 Location: Home of Wild Turkey Whiskey
Not for Hire doesn't matter, it's how you are registered that matters. If it has John Doe on the registration you can play dumb, and you may get outta there with your cash. If it has John Doe's Quarter Horses, you better have a CDL if over 26K.
Posted 2007-03-27 7:43 AM (#57870 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Veteran
Posts: 246 Location: Northern IN.
We run into this crap all the time, we live up in the crner of the state, you can go 10 miles North and be in MI. or 10 miles East and be in Ohio, and you tend to get different stories from each state and the officers there. It's very frustrating when you THINK (honestly) that you have everything that you need to be legal, then ten miles down the road you're in a defferent state and they treat you like the biggest, sneakiest, criminal in the world! One of my good friends lives in Ohio, he was trying to be legal and get his DOT numbers, they told him that the only way for him to get one was to have a Federal rep. come to his farm and have a big pow-wow, and explain to him all the paperwork that he has to keep track of and all the taxes that he has to pay, and keep tract of, etc. etc. BUT he is NOT commercial, makes no money with his outfit, so it's a big catch 22. GRRRRRR! talk to y'all later...
Posted 2007-03-27 11:00 AM (#57884 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Expert
Posts: 3802 Location: Rocky Mount N.C.
My truck has plates for 24,000#. GVW on the truck is 11,400#, trailer GVW is 14,000# I weigh loaded anywhere from 17,000#-18,500#. I don't advertise my name or farm name on the side of the truck. I run North Carolina Commercial Farm Truck plates. If a horse is in my trailer, it's my horse. I don't care who's name is on the papers......HE'S MY HORSE. I don't stop at anyone's scales. I do stop at the Fl. ag. inspection stations (all trucks and trailers have to stop) but I don't roll through or over the scales....Don't start nothing, won't be nothing! If they want to talk to you, they'll come get you (run you down) and tell you what you need to be legal, (their interpretation). Stopped at the I-95 south bound Fl. ag. inspection with two horses last friday about noon going into Fl. Officer never got out of the "airconditioned hut", he said "pull over to the right, bring me your paper work and drivers license". He never looked at the horses, just the paperwork and entered needed info into the computer. Stopped at the north bound I-95 ag inspection station monday morning around 04:00 and it was the same deal, just looked at the papers and never saw the horses. It was dark and with the dark tinted windows he would have never known that there were any horses in the trailer, could have waved on through. I guess what I'm trying to say is, just be discreet, don't try to show off or brag on "I got a big ole truck and trailer, look at me, look at me!" Just be sure that you are plated for at least your GCVW. Have a Updated Coggins and Health certificate for YOUR HORSES in the trailer, (Florida is within 30 days) and save all that money on special licence, fancy signs, log books and the time to fill them out (you'll need about three at the same time, don't show the scale man the wrong book!) We show in Pa, Ohio, Tn, Va, Ky, In, WV, NC, SC, Ga, Fl, Al, Md. and I've never stopped at a scales to be weighed or have truck and trailer registration's checked. Like I said, "don't start nothing, won't be nothing!" Oh, I forgot. I don't have a CDL anymore, they expired while in the hospital having a leg amputated, and never bothered to try finding a tractor trailer that has an automatic transmission to go redo the driving test. I'm driving with a valid N.C. class C, regular, plain old, nothing extra added drivers license....And will continue to do so! What are they going to do.....EAT ME?!!
Posted 2007-03-27 12:55 PM (#57891 - in reply to #57681) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Member
Posts: 28 Location: Portage, IN
Exactly, I am in law enforcement and know what cops thinks. We can care less if it is joe schmoe going to a show, but if it is a commercial vehicle it needs to be legal. As I said I do not plan on stopping at any weigh stations, Ag. Inspections are different, I WILL stop at those if needed. We will have the Tests done and everything so do not need to worry about the papers. I have seen many simis with a 40' enclosed trailer pass up scales, WHEN OPEN and never get chased down, they can care less about a bumber pull trailer being pulled by an F-150 pick up truck. I will however stop if the sinage before the stations says all vehicles with trailers or all trucks. In CA ALL weigh stations say all TRUCKS MUST STOP but have NO PICK-UPS beolow it, so regardless if you have a huge trailer or what ever if your in a pick up you dont not stop.
Posted 2007-03-27 1:15 PM (#57894 - in reply to #57891) Subject: RE: Maryland and the CDL
Expert
Posts: 1719 Location: PA
I have a 3H 38' box LQ that I pull with a 4500. When I registered the truck in PA, I was told to register the truck as a combo rated up to 26,000 so I would not need a CDL. I haven't stopped at any weigh stations but I will stop at ag stations at the border. I was also told by a friend that if I do get hassled, to show them my AQHA amateur card as proof that I am not doing it as a business. So far so good!
Maryland and the CDL
This might be a good idea for safety education,ect.But a special license? What a bunch of nonsense.
.jpg)
I just what to ride 
