Wondering if anyone has had Polylast flooring put in their trailer. I am planning on having it put in my Sundowner Sierra 8012. Anyone that has experience with it would be appreciated. Also have to decide if I want to have it sealed or not.
Posted 2012-11-11 9:03 AM (#148230 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
Elite Veteran
Posts: 824 Location: Kansas
I would sure think you'd want it sealed (I took that to mean sealing the polylast). I will be interested to know how you like it. Looks like it might have better cushion than the WERM.
Posted 2012-11-11 8:26 PM (#148243 - in reply to #148230) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 16
Retento, it does look like it is very similar to WERM. It is a ground rubber with a poly bonding agent. It is about $13/sq.ft, so it is not cheap but, I am sick of pulling mats and all my tack and dog kennels to clean the floor. The dealer that is going to do it has it in the entry to their store and had a new trailer with it installed. It looked pretty nice. It is trowelled in at 1/2" to 1" thick.
Terri, I am thinking of having it sealed so the urine won't get down in the rubber. I think that will cause more odor. The manufacturer recommends not sealing.
Posted 2012-11-12 4:06 PM (#148263 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 16
Terri, I talked to Herman at Polylast. He said you can have if sealed (topcoated with polyurethane) or unsealed.
He recommends unsealed 3/4" in the trailer as the urine will drain. Sealed the urine doesn't drain as well and you will need to use shavings. If I don't like unsealed, I can have it sealed later.
On my ramp he recommended 3/8" to keep the weight down and sealing to give it better strength.
Posted 2012-11-12 9:37 PM (#148275 - in reply to #148263) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
Expert
Posts: 3853 Location: Vermont
Originally written by TTdogs on 2012-11-12 4:06 PM
Terri, I talked to Herman at Polylast. He said you can have if sealed (topcoated with polyurethane) or unsealed.
He recommends unsealed 3/4" in the trailer as the urine will drain. Sealed the urine doesn't drain as well and you will need to use shavings. If I don't like unsealed, I can have it sealed later.
On my ramp he recommended 3/8" to keep the weight down and sealing to give it better strength.
If the trailer has a solid aluminum floor under the polylast...where is the urine going to drain to?
Posted 2012-11-15 6:41 PM (#148340 - in reply to #148275) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 6
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Originally written by PaulChristenson on 2012-11-12 8:37 PM
If the trailer has a solid aluminum floor under the polylast...where is the urine going to drain to?
Hi Paul, I'm an official Polylast rep and wanted to answer your question.
Holes are drilled in the aluminum and then the entire aluminum surface is pre-coated with a protectorant that lines the holes to prevent any corrosion. With the porous system, no bedding or shavings are required. With the nonporous system very little bedding is required. Both surfaces have a ten year warranty on the Polylast and there are no mats necessary for either finish. The surface is softer, more comfortable and so slip resistant that is a safer and more secure footing surface than any other.
Let me know if anyone has anymore questions about Polylast and I'd be happy to answer. Feel free to learn more about us with the links in my signature. :)
Posted 2012-11-16 10:58 AM (#148366 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 824 Location: Kansas
I'm with you until you put the polylast over the entire floor. Doesn't that cover the drain holes you just made? I have rhino-lining in mine although I found I still needed mats. I use bedding to absorb the urine but hose the bed out regularly. What I am trying to say is that I haven't found the urine to be a problem in a floor without holes.
Posted 2012-11-16 4:52 PM (#148375 - in reply to #148366) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 6
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Originally written by gard on 2012-11-15 10:16 PM
Why are holes drilled into the flooring and specifically what "protectorant" is used before the Polylast is applied?
Is the product repairable and what happens if it delaminates from the flooring?
Thank you
Polylast C & S flooring material is porous so liquids pass through it freely. Horse trailers are ideal for this surface because it is so slip resistant, even when wet, that horses are more relaxed and comfortable and there is no dust or debris from shavings blowing around. It's also sound deadening and takes the temperature of the surrounding air so trailer floors stay warmer in the winter and cooler in the summer. The primer - protectorant is an isocyanate.
Is the product repairable and what happens if it delaminates from the flooring?
If the floor does delaminate it is because the trailer floor was not prepared properly and the solution is to clean, prep and reapply Polylast to that area. Polylast adheres to itself as well as it does to metal, wood, concrete, asphalt, plastic or any other semi or non porous material. As for durability, the product, when installed in a horse trailer by a certified dealer, comes with a ten year transferable warranty.
Originally written by terri s on 2012-11-16 10:58 AM
I'm with you until you put the polylast over the entire floor. Doesn't that cover the drain holes you just made? I have rhino-lining in mine although I found I still needed mats. I use bedding to absorb the urine but hose the bed out regularly. What I am trying to say is that I haven't found the urine to be a problem in a floor without holes.
Rhino-liner and other protective, bed liner type products, including Werm are great for your trailer, as is Polylast. One of the unique attributes of Polylast is that it has the same protection for your trailer floor, but offers much greater comfort and safety to your horses. Horses are more comfortable since the flooring is slip resistant even when wet and they're more comfortable since there's no dust contaminating the air or irritating their eyes. You can imagine how much you save by not having to buy, install, remove and dispose of shavings since you won't have to use ANY bedding. If a person chooses the nonporous Polylast System only enough bedding needs to be used to absorb any moisture that might flow. There are no mats to pull, clean and dry and the surface can be cleaned with any water hose. These are some of the reasons that Polylast is the ideal surface for wash racks, stalls, AI Collection areas and so on.
Posted 2012-11-16 5:14 PM (#148376 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 149 Location: Harrisburg, OR
Gard, the holes are drilled if you are going with the porous system so the urine drains out of the trailer. The porous Polylast is ideal in conjunction with Logan's "whiz proof" slatted floors. The product is repairable as well. Many of the vet offices and horse facilities out here with concrete floors are starting to use it. It's very similar to the stuff you see on children's playgrounds but geared for equine use (tougher).
Terri, yes the polylast will cover the holes. Since it is a porous material it will still allow the urine to drain thru the holes though. However, I am not sold on punching a bunch of holes in the floor. The porous polylast is more suited for self draining floors.
Posted 2012-11-16 10:42 PM (#148382 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
Expert
Posts: 5870 Location: western PA
"Polylast C & S flooring material is porous so liquids pass through it freely. Horse trailers are ideal for this surface because it is so slip resistant, even when wet, that horses are more relaxed and comfortable and there is no dust or debris from shavings blowing around."
Is the isocyanate used as a flooring sealant or just spotting to coat the drilled drain holes?.
Am I to understand that any fluid will pass through the surfacing to the flooring, and the holes are then drilled to allow it to drain underneath? It sounds as if the product behaves like an open cell sponge, that allows the fluid to pass trough its body. Has your company ever physically removed the product after a couple of years and inspected the aluminum flooring? With no airflow, how can any fluid not near a drain hole dry out? Won't it remain wet and active for an extended period?
Having never done so, I would not be surprised to find trapped urine causing problems. At least with mats, the flooring can be flushed. With a bed liner material installed, the flooring is protected. With WERM, if not damaged, the flooring is not wetted.
Posted 2012-11-17 3:24 PM (#148394 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 83
I would have to agree that a non porous floor system in a wet enviroment wouldn't seem logical. 3/4" of porous material holding urine, stool and other things sounds like a potential breeding ground for bacteria. Not to mention where all that urine sits until it goes through a hole. It doesn't seem logical that the urine is going to "find the hole"? Even if it is topped with a urethane to make it non porous, what happens if the thin top coat wears? I would guess with the top coat that only the top of the floor would be non porous. With 3/4" of coating it would be hard to ever see what was happening to your aluminum floor.
Posted 2012-11-18 7:55 AM (#148404 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 824 Location: Kansas
I wonder about its application in stalls. I like the idea of the cushioning and for a properly prepared stall floor, with drainage, and the idea of not having to fill and level stalls every couple of years appeals to me. Concrete would certainly work for me, but not necessarily for the horses. I use my stalls primarily as run in stalls but the horses use them primarily as indoor toilets.
Posted 2012-11-19 7:57 PM (#148460 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 218 Location: Ohio
My wife and I too were looking at Polylast until they talked about putting holes in the floor. That has scared us off for now. We talked with a rep at the Quarter Horse Congress. The system sounds great but I don't want a bunch of holes drilled in the floor. I am afraid it will weaken the floor. I am not sure how it couldn't. I am not so worried about urine and needing some shavings. I just don't want urine sitting under the mats. My horses don't urinate in the trailer unless we are on long trips and then only if we put shavings in. They don't like to get splashed. So shavings would be used either way.
If the rep is still monitoring this, can you seal this and still get the same benefits other than letting it drain. I like the idea of less vibration, less noise and less heat from the road. I also don't want to have another weekend of pulling mats and power-washing the floor. If you seal the floor and don't allow it to drain, spraying it out after the trip is much easier than pulling mats. I just don't want the sealant to to where off and then it is porous but has no place to drain.
Posted 2012-11-19 10:36 PM (#148470 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 6
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Originally written by gard on 2012-11-16 9:42 PM
"Polylast C & S flooring material is porous so liquids pass through it freely. Horse trailers are ideal for this surface because it is so slip resistant, even when wet, that horses are more relaxed and comfortable and there is no dust or debris from shavings blowing around."
Is the isocyanate used as a flooring sealant or just spotting to coat the drilled drain holes?.
It is used as an impermeable barrier over the entire floor which tends to stop or reduce corrosion on aluminum floors. It also seals wooden floors and greatly increases their useful life span.
Am I to understand that any fluid will pass through the surfacing to the flooring, and the holes are then drilled to allow it to drain underneath? It sounds as if the product behaves like an open cell sponge, that allows the fluid to pass trough its body. Has your company ever physically removed the product after a couple of years and inspected the aluminum flooring? With no airflow, how can any fluid not near a drain hole dry out? Won't it remain wet and active for an extended period?
Yes. The pores in the crumb remain open or are easily reopened and flushed clean using a garden hose with a nozzle. High pressure cleaners can be used although if the floor is rinsed out, periodically, there's usually no need. The analogy of a "sponge" isn't a good one since the rubber crumb which is 100% recycled rubber wont' absorb any liquids so the crumb is hard and non porous and non absorbent. Liquids and air move freely through the crumb. To see a video of this happening done by "Mister Truck" go to www.logancoach.com/whiz-proof. As a test, we removed 1/2 of a Polylast installation on a wooden floor that was over 12 years old... the original paint was still visible on the trailer floor! Keep in mind the warranty. As for the moisture "finding a hole" Polylast is porous horizontally as well as vertically and since air circulates through the crumb, liquids evaporate.
Having never done so, I would not be surprised to find trapped urine causing problems. At least with mats, the flooring can be flushed. With a bed liner material installed, the flooring is protected. With WERM, if not damaged, the flooring is not wetted.
Thanks for your previous replies.
The urine isn't trapped in Porous applications... it flows through and evaporates! Should an owner not want to drill holes in the trailer all of Polylasts attributes can enjoyed in a nonporouw application except a limited amount of shavings shold be used to keep liquids from flowing or sloshing on the floor. As for the mats... who in their right mind enjoys pulling and cleaning them? Who does it often enough? The flooring is actually better protected as with Werm, or other lining products... Unlike Werm and those other lining products which can be damaged, Polylast is more comfortable, safer and the patented recycled rubber crumb even protects the primer so it can't be scratched or torn which lets liquids through to the aluminum.
Thanks for your previous replies.
That's what I'm here for :P
Originally written by Jaas on 2012-11-17 2:24 PM
I would have to agree that a non porous floor system in a wet enviroment wouldn't seem logical. 3/4" of porous material holding urine, stool and other things sounds like a potential breeding ground for bacteria. Not to mention where all that urine sits until it goes through a hole. It doesn't seem logical that the urine is going to "find the hole"? Even if it is topped with a urethane to make it non porous, what happens if the thin top coat wears? I would guess with the top coat that only the top of the floor would be non porous. With 3/4" of coating it would be hard to ever see what was happening to your aluminum floor.
Check the Polylast web page to learn where you can inspect a Polylast installation (Link in my signature). Your question about a "thin urethane coating to make it non porous is a great one! All Polylast surfaces porous and non porous, are top coated as a way to increase the strength of the crumb bond. In non porous applications, the non porous material is trowel-forced across the surface and down, below the top surface crumb. This way the hardness and durability of the recycled rubber protects the integrity of the top coat ensuring the waterproofness and at the same time maintaining the overall cushion and slip resistance of the floor. In summary, unlike all other flooring systems, Polylast protects your trailer AND your horses while saving you time and labor (no pulling or cleaning mats, buying shavings, removing and disposing of used shavings).
Originally written by terri s on 2012-11-18 6:55 AM
I wonder about its application in stalls. I like the idea of the cushioning and for a properly prepared stall floor, with drainage, and the idea of not having to fill and level stalls every couple of years appeals to me. Concrete would certainly work for me, but not necessarily for the horses. I use my stalls primarily as run in stalls but the horses use them primarily as indoor toilets.
Polylast does offer a unique stall liner system with the same attributes and more.
Posted 2012-11-29 10:04 PM (#148655 - in reply to #148460) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 6
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Originally written by Goz63 on 2012-11-19 6:57 PM
My wife and I too were looking at Polylast until they talked about putting holes in the floor. That has scared us off for now. We talked with a rep at the Quarter Horse Congress. The system sounds great but I don't want a bunch of holes drilled in the floor. I am afraid it will weaken the floor. I am not sure how it couldn't. I am not so worried about urine and needing some shavings. I just don't want urine sitting under the mats. My horses don't urinate in the trailer unless we are on long trips and then only if we put shavings in. They don't like to get splashed. So shavings would be used either way.
If the rep is still monitoring this, can you seal this and still get the same benefits other than letting it drain. I like the idea of less vibration, less noise and less heat from the road. I also don't want to have another weekend of pulling mats and power-washing the floor. If you seal the floor and don't allow it to drain, spraying it out after the trip is much easier than pulling mats. I just don't want the sealant to to where off and then it is porous but has no place to drain.
All of your points are well taken. Polylast is available in a nonporous application with the difference being that the top coat is an epoxy material which is special in that it stays flexible unlike most epoxys that harden and turn brittle as they age. The resulting surface has all the cushion and slip resistance of the porous Polylast except that the epoxy is troweled into the cured crumb so it penetrates down into the rubber. This ensures that the surface remains waterproof since the rubber crumb protects the binding of the epoxy to the crumb. Rinsing the surface with a garden hose is all that's needed to clean the floor and mats are never needed. since the surface remains compliant. Very little to no shavings are required, depending of the time horses are in the trailer, since the texture of the crumb reduces or eliminates "splashing." One other, often overlooked, attribute is that the floors can be colored other than black so horses can better see the surface and, therefore, are more comfortable.
Posted 2012-11-30 1:37 PM (#148658 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 83
"The analogy of a 'sponge' isn't a good one since the rubber crumb which is 100% recycled rubber won't absorb any liquids so the crumb is hard and non porous and non absorbent.
"The resulting surface has all the cushion and slip resistance of the porous Polylast except that the epoxy is troweled into the cured crumb so it penetrates down into the rubber."
I'm not trying to bust your chops here, but your own statements contradict each other, as noted by your words above. Unless your epoxy isn't a liquid.
I believe the liquid portion of urine and stool will evaporate, but we have all seen dried urine under mats. The acid is still present.
I'm not so sure 100% recycled rubber is quite as non porous and chemical resistant as you may think.
As has been debated on here many times before, if a floor is "soft" enough to make it cushion a horses feet, its physical strength is also "soft" enough to wear. If hard enough for good physical strengths, then not very soft for horses and no need to go that thick.
I don't know the physical properties of the epoxy, or the urethane top coat. In the statement above you state epoxy is troweled into the cured crumb so it penetrates down into the rubber." I thought before you said you topped it with a urethane? But if you put that heavy of a top coat over the system to make it non porous wouldn't it also make it that much harder? I would think filling in the voids of your porous rubber system with a hard liquid material would take most of the cushion out of your rubber filler.
Does the long warranty cover replacing just the epoxy flooring, or any ruined aluminum floor also?
Posted 2012-12-01 6:42 PM (#148671 - in reply to #148655) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 218 Location: Ohio
Knowing we can have a non-porous floor and don't have to drill holes in it makes me feel much better. I liked all the other attributes of the floor. I did know about the colors and that it makes the horses see better. I liked the cushioning the floor offers better than anything else we looked at. We will look at an early spring instillation now. We have the trailer all winterized and put away for the winter.
Posted 2012-12-03 3:42 PM (#148699 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 6
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Originally written by Jaas on 2012-11-30 12:37 PM
"The analogy of a 'sponge' isn't a good one since the rubber crumb which is 100% recycled rubber won't absorb any liquids so the crumb is hard and non porous and non absorbent. The resulting surface has all the cushion and slip resistance of the porous Polylast except that the epoxy is troweled into the cured crumb so it penetrates down into the rubber."
I'm not trying to bust your chops here, but your own statements contradict each other, as noted by your words above. Unless your epoxy isn't a liquid. I believe the liquid portion of urine and stool will evaporate, but we have all seen dried urine under mats. The acid is still present.
Again, no "chop busting," these are all reasonable questions. The aluminum is protected by the primer seal. The urine and manure either passes through the porous floor or remains on top of the nonporous floor and there are no mats to pull or clean. Rinsing the surface with water is recommended.
I suggest you look at either www.polylasthorsefloors.com or www.logancoach.com where you can see how the porous floor works. You're right about the recycled rubber not being absorbent but in the porous application the pores between the rubber allow for liquids to flow through and out. The epoxy used in the nonporous system is liquid until it cures. By trowellling the epoxy down into the recycled crumb the pores are closed and sealed and the bond goes beneath the top surface so it can't be scraped of... therefor it is a permanent seal. The epoxy is a special, proprietary blend that remains flexible so that the seals between the crumb stay elastic and the surface IS soft, cushioning and slip resistant.
I'm not so sure 100% recycled rubber is quite as non porous and chemical resistant as you may think.
We've been installing it for many years and installed many thousands of square feet in 2012, alone.
As has been debated on here many times before, if a floor is "soft" enough to make it cushion a horses feet, its physical strength is also "soft" enough to wear. If hard enough for good physical strengths, then not very soft for horses and no need to go that thick.
This is incorrect actually. Polylast utilizes a patented process that is much stronger than other flooring systems and has just the right amount of cushion so while there is no strain on joints from a too soft surface, the cushioning effect is very comforting. Again, check it out for yourself.
I don't know the physical properties of the epoxy, or the urethane top coat. In the statement above you state epoxy is troweled into the cured crumb so it penetrates down into the rubber." I thought before you said you topped it with a urethane? But if you put that heavy of a top coat over the system to make it non porous wouldn't it also make it that much harder? I would think filling in the voids of your porous rubber system with a hard liquid material would take most of the cushion out of your rubber filler.
Again, that just isn't true due to the attributes of the patented system.
Does the long warranty cover replacing just the epoxy flooring, or any ruined aluminum floor also?
The Polylast warranty covers the product, not the subsurface, only when applied by an authorized dealer - certified installer.
Posted 2012-12-05 3:08 PM (#148734 - in reply to #148700) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 6
Location: Phoenix, AZ
Originally written by Goz63 on 2012-12-01 5:42 PM
Knowing we can have a non-porous floor and don't have to drill holes in it makes me feel much better. I liked all the other attributes of the floor. I did know about the colors and that it makes the horses see better. I liked the cushioning the floor offers better than anything else we looked at. We will look at an early spring instillation now. We have the trailer all winterized and put away for the winter.
Posted 2013-02-05 10:07 AM (#149725 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
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Posts: 16
OK, I have now used my trailer with the Polylast flooring installed. I hauled my horse and 3 dogs on a 1,300 mile round trip.
The urine definately drains from the trailer leaving only manure.
I washed the entire trailer when I got home because of all the road de-icer. Also washed the inside, where the horse urine is in the floor it take a little while to flush the polylast. A small sprinkler left in there for an hour or so in warmer weather would do the trick.
I am very happy with the finished product and would do it again. It cost about $1,300 for a 3 horse and the ramp.
Posted 2013-02-05 10:20 AM (#149727 - in reply to #148223) Subject: RE: Trailer Flooring- Polylast
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 385 Location: high desert, CA.
I saw a demo of the polylast at the Horse Expo in Pomona Calif last week end. It was pretty nice, several colors, and a couple of the trailers on exhibit were done with it. ( High end Liv qtrs type. Looks to be the best way to have permanent flooring. The cost is pretty steep, but if you are going to be traveling and using your trailer a lot, it sure makes sense. If I were sure we would not be selling our 4 horse in the near future, I would do this.
Trailer Flooring- Polylast
