Posted 2007-05-05 10:12 PM (#60445) Subject: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Regular
Posts: 57 Location: FL
Our six year western pleasure gelding has always had a sensitive mouth. However, until this year we did not have a problem with him tossing his head (which result in the reins flipping over his head) or with him rearing up when you lift the reins.
However, in January we sent him to a trainer who said he had a bad habit of rearing. We were stunned becuase we never had a problem with him rearing before. (I told the trainer this). Trainer #1 ended up flipping the horse which supposingly corrected this problem.
In April, we sent the horse to another trainer. With Trainer #2 he started flipping the reins (in addition to coming of the ground too. This trainer says the problem can be fixed but hit will take a long time to correct. This trainer his relocating at the end of this month.
Do any of the board members have any suggestions on how to correct this?
Posted 2007-05-05 10:54 PM (#60446 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Location: KY
You may wish to have his teeth checked; vet check him out; chiropractor also....and maybe consider keeping the horse at home or with a softer method trainer....good luck
Posted 2007-05-05 11:33 PM (#60450 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 544 Location: Claxton, Ga.
I don't mean this in a bad way but, GET ANOTHER TRAINER. Normaly yes, if a horse accidently flips over backwards while rearing they will normally not do it again. If this happens you can't put the horse up. You must get him to calm down and go on. Only end the ride or training session on a good positive note. If the horse was put up after the incident he will relate this action with going back to the barn and a no ride day. Yeapie.... so he will continue to try this again and again. Have you had his teeth checked for any issues? He sounds like he has some spirit and is very sensitive. With this type of horse you don't have to be near as forceful. Just a small amount of pressure will work great. If you use too much pressure that is when he will come unglued. Does anyone use Clinton Anderson's methods in your area. Sounds like some flexing while on the ground and desesitizing is what he needs.
Posted 2007-05-05 11:36 PM (#60451 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Expert
Posts: 2828 Location: Southern New Mexico
Have his teeth checked and maybe use a running martingale on him to keep the reins from flipping up. It may also help you to keep him from popping his head up to rear.
If it wasn't happening before he went to the first trainer, I would say there was some serious ill fitting equipment or mishandeling.
Posted 2007-05-06 2:49 PM (#60466 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Member
Posts: 38 Location: waverly, tn 37185
In addition to having the teeth and mouth checked, I would also consider another area. Have his back checked. It could very possibly be out of line and this is causing pain, discomfort. I have had similar problem and it was horses back. I sent my gelding to a chiropractor (sp?) and horse is fine now. Actually this was a QH but I also had same problem with a TWH that needed a spinal adjustment. The cause? Well, I have this like for tall horses despite my being only 5'4 and when I would mount, I would have to pretty much pull myself up, pulling on the saddle, which inturn pulled the horses' backs out. Lesson learned, jump higher and quicker when mounting or use a bucket! Lol!
Posted 2007-05-06 9:15 PM (#60481 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Extreme Veteran
Posts: 322 Location: Fort Madison, Iowa
I have a horse that did the same thing and found changing to a saddle that fits properly and taking him to a chiropractor has helped tremendous.
I can tell now when he needs a treatment he'll start flipping his head & reins. I usually try getting away with doing a spring treatment and a fall treatment before going on a hard riding vacation. I did have to do three last year but it's worth not having the behaviour problems you have to deal with when a horse is sore.
Posted 2007-05-06 10:18 PM (#60485 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Expert
Posts: 1989 Location: South Central OK
If it showed up at a trainer then I'd blame the trainer for the issue and tell people about it. I don't know if you feel it's worth following the second trainer...I feel you have some hesitation about them also.
I had a pony that did this because once he crow hopped I'd cry, get off and put him back out in the pasture. A GREAT lesson to teach a horse, misbehave and get your way. We hired a teenage boy that came out and broke him in about 10 minutes with a dozen eggs...follow me and I know this sounds crazy.
Step one get on horse with a pocket of eggs. Once mounted grab an egg. When the horse starts to elevate to rear as his head comes up smash an egg on his pole. Same thing next time, but I've NEVER seen a next time. It goes off the theory that the horse will think there is a roof over his head and the egg simulates him bleeding but with no pain. We used the other eleven eggs.
A more aggressive method which seems to take a longer amount of time to really work and is more teach with pain( I hate these methods but some do have a place with dangerous horses) is to use a bat or crop to pop his pole upon rearing and smacking his shoulder when head tossing.
My approach would be changing his bit. If the first trainer was heavy handed (and a good chunk of WP trainers are) and this caused the initial behavior the horse has associated the bit with imminent punishment and is fighting back before it happens. Bring the horse home and change the bit and I bet you'll get your WP horse back.
Posted 2007-05-06 10:46 PM (#60489 - in reply to #60485) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Expert
Posts: 2828 Location: Southern New Mexico
My ex-stepmother used a similar approach. She cut a slit in a soda bottle and filled it with water. When the horse would pop his head up she would hit him with it and the water would gush out. No sticky mess to clean out of the forelock.
Posted 2007-05-07 6:32 PM (#60533 - in reply to #60445) Subject: RE: Help with horse rearing, tossing head
Member
Posts: 44 Location: Montana
Have his teeth cheeked and his back as well. Also you may want to watch how he is moving on the ground. I just recently was given a former WP horse and after watching him move I noticed he held his muscles very tightly. I do allot of Dressage and so I put him in a Dressage program. He learned how to carry himself and how to relax. The training was only up to first level so still a lower headset and relaxed gates. He just came back from a 2-week show run with a girl who shows WP and Hunter under saddle. All the judges commented on how well he looked and she won every class she was in. Try a bitles bridal as well. He may be feeling too much pressure with his sensitive mouth.
If a trainer ever uses the bad behavior as a way of teaching the horse not to do it, (such as flipping the horse on purpose) find a new trainer. I sold a horse and heard he started bucking, so the people sent him to a "good trainer" who proceeded to put a bucking strap on him and making him buck to "get it out of his system." I can say that that horse could really buck. Did he get it out of his system? No a local cowboy bought him to practice his bareback riding on. Former Hunter over Fences is now a wonderful bucking horse and all because they didn’t cheek the tack and sent him to the wrong trainer.