OK.  so we have this  7 yr old TWH mare...  she's a wonderful trail horse,  and a joy to ride- the tougher the trail the better she likes it.    She's dominent in the pasture and used to be  very pushy  on the ground w/ people too but I've fixed that annoying habit.    We've had her about a year and a half.  she used to paw a little bit in the trailer but now she does it all the time.  she's pawed a hole in the rubber mat of the 2 horse and last time she was in the slant load -11 hr trip- she pawed to the point the front of her pasterns were raw and bloody.   it dosn't matter if she has another horse in the trailer or not.    and it's not my driving skills either.  when the trailer is stopped w/ the door open she's fine of course.  I've even tried stopping the trailer in the middle of the road, screaming at her like a banshee (the neighbors love that)...  she'll only stop pawing when the door is open.   the second we go down the road again it starts up- WHAM, WHAM, WHAM.   

thing is, she dosn't seem upset in any way.   w/ the exception of the pawing she's calm and eats well.  she loads and unloads perfectly. 

So far I've tried

• moving the partition in the 2 horse
• removing the pratition in the 2 horse
• kicking chains on one/both of her front legs
• moving her in different stalls in the big slant load
• letting her totally loose in the big slant load
• hobbles on her front legs.

she can be loose facing either direction in the trailer and will still paw. 

the hobbles were a last resort.  I taught her to hobble a few weeks ago,   she was fine w/ them.. pissed her off I think since she's such a dominent horse but she had the sense to realize fighting them wouldn't work.   I've never hobbled a horse in the trailer and was kinda scared to do it but did it anyway yesterday morning.   we only trailered maybe 15 min. away and she was fine so I was thinking this is great- no pawing.  WRONG.   on the way back she started it up again.    there was maybe 12 inches of play in the hobbles.  figured she'd need that to balance.    not only can she balance but she can paw too.  grrrrrrrrrr..      I took up in the links about 3 inches and will try again in a little while. 

what do all of you think?   is there a cure for this beast?

It sounds like you've done a thorough job trying to assess this mare, and then trying to find ways to stop her pawing. Therefore I don't really think there is a simple cure for her problem. I am curious, though. Does she paw when tied to other places? For example, if you tie her to a safe hitching post at home, and leave her for a while, does she paw? If so, I would assume her problem is more patience than anything, and I would start tying her for periods of the day regularly. I think in due time she would quit the whole routine.

But if she doesn't paw at home and only in the trailer, then I'm going to assume it started from a fear/discomfort issue, and now has just become a habit. Does she paw in other trailers besides your own? For example, in someone else's slant load, or someone else's straight load, or if loose in a stock trailer? If the problem becomes much less in other trailers, then perhaps she still is having some discomfort or fear issues in your trailer - for example, could it be a bit too short for her? Although I'm assuming that isn't the cause since she still paws when the dividers are removed?

I too would be rather reluctant to hobble her in a moving trailer. There will be occasions when you brake harder than you planned (just wait until you have a deer step out in front of you!) and with hobbles your horse is going to have a very hard time balancing herself. She potentially could be seriously hurt, and if nothing else, justifyably frightened. I think before I would hobble her shorter, I would consider a shock collar.

I have never tried a shock collar, but after reading articles on the topic, I think it would be a consideration for serious problems. And this horse is pawing enough to harm herself, ruin the trailer and put herself in true danger. A shock collar would probably be safer for her than hobbles, and might be the only solution for her ingrained habit. Before going further I'd advise reading articles on the topic - it sounds as though shock collars for horses are MUCH less powerful than those used for dogs, and that the first two or three settings can barely be felt by a person. If you could put a shock collar on her for a while at home so she got used to wearing it, then load her with one, and then watch from a distance, you might only have to shock her a couple of times to make her change her mind about pawing. But shock collars only work if you time things appropriately, and if you are able to monitor her behavior.

I wouldn't consider a shock collar until I was 100% certain there was no physical cause for the pawing, such as discomfort in the trailer. But if you've ruled out all those things and are getting desperate, I'd talk to a trainer or someone with experience with shock collars, and go from there. Good luck to both you and your horse. Its funny how bad habits can start so easily, yet be so hard to stop!

CG-H thanks for your suggestions.   Yes she does paw sometimes when tied, she paws when waiting to eat and sometimes when eating.    I've only had her in other trailers a couple times and yep, she pawed in those too.     I"d rather not subject my friend's trailers to her behavior.    Both my trailers are plenty tall and wide for her.  and both are very sturdy safe trailers.   my other horses manage to ride down the road just fine in them.    

  I think the pawing is a hold over from the STRIKING she used to do.   granted it's an improvement but not much of one.   She has no problem being tied.. I've tied her overnite and aside from usually digging a foot deep hole she stands there OK.      With her personality don't think tying her more often will make any difference in her trailer behavior, altho I could be wrong.           I agree it's a patience thing- she is very dominent and patience isn't her strong point.  I"ve thought about a shock collar but would definately need to get some help on that one.     We just came back from a trail ride.   She was in the trailer maybe 15 min. each way.  on the way there she was  quiet but comming back she managed to paw even w/ her front legs hobbled maybe 6" apart.   I'm mad and frustrated and pretty much at my wits end.   

guess I need to start researching shock collars?    any other suggestions/ideas?

I have a cutting horse that we have hauled for years up and down the east coast in hobbles. We have always used short one- I don't think they have very much "play" in them at all. They are a leather figure 8 hobble. He has had laminits issues for the last few years and that put an end to his pawing. (He now only gets hauled when absolutely necessary.) He was a pawer when he ate as well and that has now stopped too.

Is there any chance there is something else that could be bothering her in the trailer? Has anyone tried riding in the back with her? (Very caregfully!) I've heard some strange stories like shorts in wiring shocking the horse, flying insects... Just trying to give the horse the benefit of the doubt!

Wife bought a shock collar and figured it wouldn't work on a horse..... Well, I was wrong, that collar will make them stand and take notice. Yearling filly wanted to paw in the cross ties and paw in the stall when others were going to pasture and she were left behind in the stall..... After about three days and a couple of "zaps" a day, she's cured.

http://www.gundogsupply.com/vibreltrcofo1.html

....That and we have a new crop of babies every year, so it will be well used for years to come. Not going to have them digging up the W.E.R.M. floor in the trailer either... We got a pretty good string of show/trail horses and you best believe that they are some of the best behaved on the planet!! Not going to tolorate pawing, kicking, biting, cribbing etc.!!!

No, this mare was not abused in the past.  Spoiled maybe but not abused in any way.   As I said she can be very pushy and her ground manners have improved a lot from when we got her.  She eats great- in or out of  the trailer.   She can eat and paw simultaneously.   Granted she was a little upset the first time I put the hobbles on her in the trailer but by the 4th time was totally unconcerned,   and went right back to pawing.   If there was some way to smack her legs (well not smack I mean beat the crap out of her)  while she was in there pawing  yes that would  probably work, for a little while anyway.   there is no way to get into either of these trailers quickly w/out her seeing me so I'd loose that element of suprise.  

I like the idea of the shock collar but imagine the timing would be critical.   (Retento I'll pm you for more info. on it)

  I'll have more time next week so will train her to sidelines, that seems like a good next step.   Seems like the sidelines would have to work but I hate to trailer her all the time w/ any type of leg restraints, just for safety reasons.   will try them for a few months then see what happens when they come off.  That's what I"m worried about - does the horse go back to the old behavior once they're off?

Thanks for all your good advise and suggestions.