'
1
Forums Albums Skins 1
Search Register Logon


You are logged in as a guest. Logon or register an account to access more features.
OTHER FORUMS:    Barrel Horses  -   Trucks   -   Cutting  -   Reining  -   Roping 
'
How much can I safely tow?

Jump to page : 1 2
Now viewing page 1 [25 messages per page]
Last activity 2010-04-13 10:20 PM
29 replies, 11740 views

View previous thread :: View next thread
   General Discussion -> Trailer Talk  Click to return to Barrel Talk
Refresh
Message format
 
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-28 10:35 PM (#118115)
Subject: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN

This is what I have: 2001 GMC Sierra 4x4 SLE ext cab. 

I need to know how much of trailer I can safely tow.  I know that I have to take into consideration payload ( which I undertand to be ANY contents added to a vehicle or trailer).  Also how do I know how much any particular trailer weighs empty?  Is that info available in the same place as the GVWR info is located?  HELP....my head is spinning with all this neccessay information

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
Painted Horse
Reg. May 2005
Posted 2010-03-29 5:04 AM (#118118 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?



Expert


Posts: 2453
20001001001001002525
Location: Northern Utah

Sage, Welcome,  Yes it's confusing as to what trucks can tow. I can see why it makes your head spin.

We need to know what you have,  GM made half ton, 3/4 ton and 1 ton trucks in 2001 that all said Sierra SLE on the side. They came in Long Bed, Short Bed, Gas vs Diesel,  Manual vs Automatic, and probably with a couple of rear end gear ratio  choices. The informaton you have given us in not enough info to give you any advice.

I suggest you look at the sticker on the inside of your trucks drivers door as to what your truck is rated for. That sticker will usually give you the total GCVW that your truck is rated for.  Next you will need to run it across a certified scale to see how much your truck actually weighs. The sticker will get you in the ball park of what the truck is rated for,

There really are several numbers you need to know.

1st. GCVW  This is how much total Combined weight the truck is rated for. This is a number for Both the truck and trailer and everything you pile inside.

2nd. Towing weight   This is how much your truck is rated to pull. They usually give two numbers, Conventional and 5th wheel ratings.  Meaning bumper hitch or gooseneck/5th wheel hitch. This number usually reflects the GCVW minus the trucks weight to equal the what the truck wil tow.

3rd. Maximum Payoad.  This is how much weight can actually be placed on your trucks axles and does not include the weight that rest on the trailers axles. This is often calculated by taking the trucks GVWR and subtracting the trucks actual weight.

Each of these weights will be different depending on the model of truck you have, it's engine and transmission.  Most of the spec sheets will say that a 3/4 ton is rated at a certain payload,  Then you need to look at what your truck weighs empty. For example a Ford 250  can have a 9000, 9200, 9400, 9600 9800 and 10,000 GVWR  A regular cab, gas engine, short bed, 4x2 truck might weigh 6100 lbs - the 9000 GVWR = a payload of 2900.  Where as a Crew Cab Diesel, Long bed, 4x4 truck will have 10,000lb GVWR rating  but since the truck weighs 8400 lbs can only haul 1600 lbs of payload.

We as internet friends will only be able to give you ball park answers.

As far as trailers, They also have a sticker showing what they are rated to weigh. These show what the trailers rated maximum loaded weight can be. Very few trailers actually show the empty weight.  But a call to the manufactures can usually get you a ball park number of what it weighed empty. The manufactures are shipping their trailers, so they get used to what they are paying for to the shippers.

Even with the knowledge of what the trailer weighs, you will need to find out how much of that weight sits on the trailer axles and how much rest on the truck. And the only way you will find those numbers is to load the trailer up and run across a scale.

Let us know the following:

Is your truck a 1500, 2500 or a 3500.  What engine does it have, is it a Long bed or short bed.  You already told us it's a extended cab. From that info somebody can look up the GMC Specs and give you an idea.

 

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-29 7:40 AM (#118121 - in reply to #118118)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN
OOPPPS, probably one of the more important pieces of info. Is a 1500
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-29 8:10 AM (#118122 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN

Its a 1500 with a 4.6L engine ( whatever that means )

GVWR 6400 ( there is not a number that indicates the GCWR )

On the bumper it says MAX tongue = 500 / MAX trailer is = 5000

On the hitch it says MAX tongue is = 600/ MAX trailer is = 5000

 

thanks so much for your help.  Seems like I need an engineering degree to figure this stuff out

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
retento
Reg. Aug 2004
Posted 2010-03-29 8:12 AM (#118123 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 3802
20001000500100100100
Location: Rocky Mount N.C.
Originally written by sage on 2010-03-28 11:35 PM

This is what I have: 2001 GMC Sierra 4x4 SLE ext cab. 

I need to know how much of trailer I can safely tow.  I know that I have to take into consideration payload ( which I undertand to be ANY contents added to a vehicle or trailer).  Also how do I know how much any particular trailer weighs empty?  Is that info available in the same place as the GVWR info is located?  HELP....my head is spinning with all this neccessay information

First you need to know what engine, transmission, and rear end gear ratio you have. After you find that you can look up the trucks tow rating here.....

 http://www.trailerlife.com/images/downloads/01towingguide.pdf

So far as the trailer's weight, take it to a truck stop scale, then you can weigh the truck and trailer together and get the Gross Combined Weight.

 



Edited by retento 2010-03-29 8:15 AM
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-29 8:36 AM (#118124 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN
how do I know if I have a V8 or a V6??
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
nobodyimportant
Reg. Jan 2010
Posted 2010-03-29 9:22 AM (#118127 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Veteran


Posts: 123
100
Location: Indiana
4.6L is a V-8.  If you are going to pull a bumper pull, then I personally wouldn't tow anything over 3500#'s unless you are going through Nebraska or Kansas.  Goosenecks typically will have a 15% higher tow rating due to the fact that the weight is directly over the axle.
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-29 9:43 AM (#118128 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN
#3500  would that be FULLY loaded with horse, tack, hay etc...?
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
nobodyimportant
Reg. Jan 2010
Posted 2010-03-29 10:00 AM (#118129 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Veteran


Posts: 123
100
Location: Indiana
Yes, and good luck with that.  The rule of thumb that I've always used is that you want at least 1000# of cushion when towing on anything more than a simple hill.  With what you stated at 5000#'s that would be my 2 cents.  I would double check though on the link above from trailer life and see if 5000#'s is accurate.  It seems low to me.  That is what Chevy's V-6 in their Blazer and Atro minivans can tow.
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
retento
Reg. Aug 2004
Posted 2010-03-29 11:29 AM (#118136 - in reply to #118122)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 3802
20001000500100100100
Location: Rocky Mount N.C.
Originally written by sage on 2010-03-29 9:10 AM

Its a 1500 with a 4.6L engine ( whatever that means )

GVWR 6400 ( there is not a number that indicates the GCWR )

On the bumper it says MAX tongue = 500 / MAX trailer is = 5000

On the hitch it says MAX tongue is = 600/ MAX trailer is = 5000

 

thanks so much for your help.  Seems like I need an engineering degree to figure this stuff out

 

If it's a 1500 GMC pickup, then it's a 4.3 V6 or a 4.8 or 5.3 V8.... There was no 4.6 V8 in a GMC pickup. 4.6 V8 is a Cadillac engine. Take a look again.

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
hosspuller
Reg. Oct 2003
Posted 2010-03-29 1:09 PM (#118142 - in reply to #118122)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 2953
20005001001001001002525
Location: North Carolina
Originally written by sage on 2010-03-29 5:10 AM

On the bumper it says MAX tongue = 500 / MAX trailer is = 5000

On the hitch it says MAX tongue is = 600/ MAX trailer is = 5000

thanks so much for your help.  Seems like I need an engineering degree to figure this stuff out

These stamped trailer ratings are for the bumper/hitch ONLY.   Like a Chain, the weakest link determines the strength of the complete system.

The max trailer weight your TRUCK can safely tow is likely lower.

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
Painted Horse
Reg. May 2005
Posted 2010-03-29 3:26 PM (#118158 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?



Expert


Posts: 2453
20001001001001002525
Location: Northern Utah

Looking at the post that Retento posted above,

Your truck is rated to tow 7800lbs if it has the 4.10 rear end and 6800 if it has the 3.73 rear end.( I  bet you have the 3.73)  that's assuming you have the 4.8L V-8. That should pull a two or three horse bumper pull. But I don't think you will find many goosnecks that will fit into the weight range.

With your bumper hitch rated at 5000lbs.  Two horses = 2000-2500 lbs.  Your trailer will need to weigh 3000lbs or less.

Of course yesterday I saw a Ford Ranger with a 4 horse steel stock trailer hooked up to it.  I don't know how many horses he was loading in it. But I'm sure he was over his rating.

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
flyinghfarm
Reg. Mar 2004
Posted 2010-03-29 5:04 PM (#118166 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1205
1000100100
Location: Arkansas
Appreciate your asking the question and trying to get good advice to stay safe, and not gut your truck's engine, rear end, tranny, or suspension..........but that question you have asked, always, needs an additional part to it..........and that is .......... how much weight, length, mass can my truck control in an emergency stop....another reason to build in a good margin of safety by not maximizing out your ratings,....good luck in your quest...
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2010-03-30 1:39 PM (#118216 - in reply to #118166)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1416
1000100100100100
Location: sc

Originally written by flyinghfarm on 2010-03-29 5:04 PM

Appreciate your asking the question and trying to get good advice to stay safe, and not gut your truck's engine, rear end, tranny, or suspension..........but that question you have asked, always, needs an additional part to it..........and that is .......... how much weight, length, mass can my truck control in an emergency stop....another reason to build in a good margin of safety by not maximizing out your ratings,....good luck in your quest...

No it doesn't.  The ability of the truck to provide safe stopping distances is specifically addressed in said truck's GVWR.  Don't overload your truck or trailer axles and it will stop fine.

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
flyinghfarm
Reg. Mar 2004
Posted 2010-03-30 8:56 PM (#118238 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1205
1000100100
Location: Arkansas

 

Pardon me?

Ah, perhaps I was unclear as to my more generic meaning, of what I thought was encouragement....

(Just because you can tow it doesn't mean you should, and certainly doesn't guarantee you can stop it.) We have all seen folks whose enthusiasm overloaded their wisdom, so to speak...

By Sage making inquiries to learn, means that by gathering and utilizing accurate information, will address the issues of towing and stopping.  That is a good thing, is what I meant.  Both issues are a concern to the horse towing owner, as they should be.

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
gard
Reg. Aug 2007
Posted 2010-03-31 8:08 AM (#118249 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 5870
50005001001001002525
Location: western PA

The ability of a truck to stop safely while towing a trailer is dependant on many factors. "The ability of the truck to provide safe stopping distances is specifically addressed in said truck's GVWR." This statement is simplistic and not complete.

The same weight trailer, will change the towing vehicle's balance and handling characteristics, depending on if it is using a bumper pull or goose hitch. The goose hitch results in a more balanced load, and provides a higher degree of security, especially when braking while turning.

The tires being used, with their various thread depths and designs, will effect braking distances. Environmental elements will also cause changes; ice, rain and snow can all greatly change the stopping distances. The tires' construction, radial or biased ply, will effect braking distances and towing characteristics. Varying the tire pressures, will change the braking abilities of both the towing and towed vehicles.

The mechanical condition of the trailer's brakes will greatly change its ability to stop. A rusted rotor will lessen the electromagnet's ability to apply the brakes. Worn shoes or a rusted drum will reduce the braking ability. A dirty or corroded electrical connection to the towing vehicle, can degrade the braking system's characteristics. The controller being used, will change the braking time and application strength. If it is improperly adjusted or not working correctly, braking distances will suffer.

The driver's knowledge and experience, will effect the outcome and success of a panic stop while braking in a turn. The same conditions could result in a close call or a bad mess, depending on the driver's abilities.

None of these circumstances are specifically dependent on the vehicle's GVWR for a successful tow. I suppose someone could pull a six horse trailer with a Geo Metro. Being able to do so, doesn't mean it can be done safely. Real world conditions are more determining than statistics.

BOL  Gard

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2010-03-31 11:44 AM (#118273 - in reply to #118238)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1416
1000100100100100
Location: sc
Originally written by flyinghfarm on 2010-03-30 8:56 PM

 

Pardon me?

Ah, perhaps I was unclear as to my more generic meaning, of what I thought was encouragement....

(Just because you can tow it doesn't mean you should, and certainly doesn't guarantee you can stop it.) We have all seen folks whose enthusiasm overloaded their wisdom, so to speak...

By Sage making inquiries to learn, means that by gathering and utilizing accurate information, will address the issues of towing and stopping.  That is a good thing, is what I meant.  Both issues are a concern to the horse towing owner, as they should be.

I'm sure she appreciates your clarification.

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2010-03-31 12:38 PM (#118275 - in reply to #118249)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1416
1000100100100100
Location: sc
Originally written by gard on 2010-03-31 8:08 AM

The ability of a truck to stop safely while towing a trailer is dependant on many factors. "The ability of the truck to provide safe stopping distances is specifically addressed in said truck's GVWR." This statement is simplistic and not complete.

The same weight trailer, will change the towing vehicle's balance and handling characteristics, depending on if it is using a bumper pull or goose hitch. The goose hitch results in a more balanced load, and provides a higher degree of security, especially when braking while turning.

The tires being used, with their various thread depths and designs, will effect braking distances. Environmental elements will also cause changes; ice, rain and snow can all greatly change the stopping distances. The tires' construction, radial or biased ply, will effect braking distances and towing characteristics. Varying the tire pressures, will change the braking abilities of both the towing and towed vehicles.

The mechanical condition of the trailer's brakes will greatly change its ability to stop. A rusted rotor will lessen the electromagnet's ability to apply the brakes. Worn shoes or a rusted drum will reduce the braking ability. A dirty or corroded electrical connection to the towing vehicle, can degrade the braking system's characteristics. The controller being used, will change the braking time and application strength. If it is improperly adjusted or not working correctly, braking distances will suffer.

The driver's knowledge and experience, will effect the outcome and success of a panic stop while braking in a turn. The same conditions could result in a close call or a bad mess, depending on the driver's abilities.

None of these circumstances are specifically dependent on the vehicle's GVWR for a successful tow. I suppose someone could pull a six horse trailer with a Geo Metro. Being able to do so, doesn't mean it can be done safely. Real world conditions are more determining than statistics.

BOL  Gard

 

That statement was complete, in the context of my post.  However by quoting one sentence out of my post, which you tend to do, I can see your confusion.  I will agree my whole statement was simplistic, and was intended to be.  Generally when someone has to ask on a forum about their tow rating, simplistic is what they're looking for.

If I go even simpler with the fact; "truck brakes stop the truck, trailer brakes stop the trailer" then technically your reply is not even related to my statement.  The majority of your examples above pertain to the trailer's ability to stop itself, and have nothing to do with the truck.......

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-31 12:55 PM (#118276 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN
So the sales man sold me a 3600# trailer, made it home successfully but not without HUGE apprehension!! The front end of my truck was all over the place!! I was VERY scared towing that. The salesman was kind enough to take it back, no questions asked & in exchange I got a 2300# trailer. HUGE difference, but I think I will look into getting stabilizer bars put on. The trailer doesnt seem to be swaying at all, put I think it will give me a little more peace of mind.
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
flyinghfarm
Reg. Mar 2004
Posted 2010-03-31 2:10 PM (#118287 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1205
1000100100
Location: Arkansas
From one lady to another, I can understand exactly how all that went!  Glad you made it back and forth, and good luck with the trailer you have now.  The weight distributing hitch with sway bar does sound like a good idea...undoubtedly others can offer more technically helpful information..
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
nobodyimportant
Reg. Jan 2010
Posted 2010-03-31 2:24 PM (#118290 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Veteran


Posts: 123
100
Location: Indiana
You absolutely need the bars.  If you can find one that is equalization and sway control the better.  Its better to have it and not need it, than need it and not have it.
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
sage
Reg. Mar 2010
Posted 2010-03-31 2:35 PM (#118293 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Member


Posts: 8

Location: MN
about how much does that cost?
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2010-03-31 2:35 PM (#118294 - in reply to #118276)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Expert


Posts: 1416
1000100100100100
Location: sc

Originally written by sage on 2010-03-31 12:55 PM

So the sales man sold me a 3600# trailer, made it home successfully but not without HUGE apprehension!! The front end of my truck was all over the place!! I was VERY scared towing that. The salesman was kind enough to take it back, no questions asked & in exchange I got a 2300# trailer. HUGE difference, but I think I will look into getting stabilizer bars put on. The trailer doesnt seem to be swaying at all, put I think it will give me a little more peace of mind.

Congratulations on your trailer purchase.  First off, a 1/2 ton pickup should easily be able to haul an empty 3600lbs trailer.  I would take a look at the tire pressure all the way around, then your shocks.  Strange the dealer took it back "no questions asked ", perhaps mechanical damage to the trailer of some sort?
 
Secondly, stabilizer bars is a misnomer; there is sway control, and Weight Distributing Hitch, and then WDH with sway control built in.  The WDH will return the weight to the front end of your truck and restore your steering and braking.  Having used the Equal-i-zer WDH with my Trailblazer and a 6000 lbs trailer, I can assure a WDH works very well.  My wife learned to tow with that combo.  The lighter trailer with two horses would be getting close to needing a WDH, IIRC 500 tongue/5000 trailer is the limit GM set for their 1/2 tons. 
 
The etrailer.com website has several videos of WDH you may want to take a look through.  http://www.etrailer.com/tvc-17-Weight-Distribution.html
 
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
nobodyimportant
Reg. Jan 2010
Posted 2010-03-31 2:41 PM (#118296 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Veteran


Posts: 123
100
Location: Indiana
It depends on the dealer you talk to.  I would say between $500-$1000.  Equalizer brand is what I've been told is the best.
share Top of the page Bottom of the page
jakey1
Reg. Dec 2003
Posted 2010-04-02 7:00 AM (#118363 - in reply to #118115)
Subject: RE: How much can I safely tow?


Extreme Veteran


Posts: 350
1001001002525
Location: Newton, NJ

It's always so entertaining to read the "how much can I tow?" threads on this site!...

So many options... So many opinions.... so many variables... and so much attitude!

Gather as much research as you can and try to make an educated purchase.  Then go out and practice driving, but without your horses.  If you have made a mistake in your choices you certainly don't want them to suffer for it.

 

 

share Top of the page Bottom of the page
Jump to page : 1 2
Now viewing page 1 [25 messages per page]
Jump to forum :
Search this forum
Printer friendly version
E-mail a link to this thread
Message format
 

'
Registered to: Horse Trailer World
(Delete all cookies set by this site)