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leveling button for hauling?

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marta
Reg. Jun 2007
Posted 2008-01-21 7:05 AM (#74920)
Subject: leveling button for hauling?


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Posts: 17

Location: NJ
we were chatting at the barn yesterday since two of the boarders got new hauling vehicles. one of them, a lexis suv was parked out front with an empty trailer attached and it looked like it was about to get launched to the moon with the front end raised up high and the rear end squashed down by the weight of the tongue. so i mentioned that it doesn't look like it's meant to haul that trailer and the owner said that it has a button that you push when hauling and it raises the rear up or something like it. i tried to do a search on that feature just out of curiosity and can't find anything. friend's gmc 2500 has it too, but she couldn't explain what it does either.
can someone explain how this works? i wouldn't give it that much thought except that image of the lexis suv at a precarious angle keeps on haunting me;)
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Towfoo
Reg. Jan 2008
Posted 2008-01-21 7:25 AM (#74922 - in reply to #74920)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?


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The Lexus probably has factory air suspension. The GMC probably as air bags.

Edited by Towfoo 2008-01-21 7:27 AM
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HWBar
Reg. Nov 2005
Posted 2008-01-21 2:09 PM (#74966 - in reply to #74920)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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My wifes Escalade has a rear air bags with self leveling feature, I can hook up a 3 horse slant bumper pull and it will squat down, wait about 30 seconds and you will hear the air pump kick on and it will relevel itself. I like it alot, better than weight distribution bars.
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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2008-01-21 2:49 PM (#74975 - in reply to #74966)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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Just the fact that a Lexus owner is hauling horses would haunt me. Let alone, you have them for a boarder. Sorry, maybe my view of Lexus owners is slightly skewed in this area of the country.

Originally written by HWBar on 2008-01-21 2:09 PM

My wifes Escalade has a rear airĀ bags with self leveling feature, I can hook up a 3 horse slant bumper pull and it will squat down, wait about 30 seconds and you will hear the air pump kick on and it will relevel itself. I like it alot, better than weight distribution bars.


Two entirely different things, aren't they? The idea of a weight distributing hitch is to distribute some of the weight from the rear axle to the front axle and trailer axles. Levelling the ride is a benefit, but more by default than by design. Air bags level the ride, but the weight carried by the rear axle will still be the same.

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong.

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HWBar
Reg. Nov 2005
Posted 2008-01-21 3:21 PM (#74977 - in reply to #74975)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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Originally written by jdzaharia on 2008-01-21 2:49 PM

 
Originally written by HWBar on 2008-01-21 2:09 PM My wifes Escalade has a rear air bags with self leveling feature, I can hook up a 3 horse slant bumper pull and it will squat down, wait about 30 seconds and you will hear the air pump kick on and it will relevel itself. I like it alot, better than weight distribution bars.
Two entirely different things, aren't they? The idea of a weight distributing hitch is to distribute some of the weight from the rear axle to the front axle and trailer axles. Levelling the ride is a benefit, but more by default than by design. Air bags level the ride, but the weight carried by the rear axle will still be the same. Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong.

 

I would assume what you are saying is correct, but I don't have weight distribution bars, and I don't feel the need to have them. When I first lowered the BP down on the Escalade it looked like I was going to have to get them until the pump kicked on. Before anyone ask the Escalade with a 6.0 liter handles the 3 horse, all steel Titan Avalanche trailer, loaded with 2 real horses,1000 lb a piece and a 600lb. pony with no problems. My wife drives it with no issues at all. 

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marta
Reg. Jun 2007
Posted 2008-01-21 4:37 PM (#74989 - in reply to #74920)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?


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Posts: 17

Location: NJ
thanks for all the replies.

yes, lexis suv hauling a horse trailer is a scary thing all in itself;) this is a haughty taughty fox hunter we're talking about (i think that speaks for itself;)).


i also had concerns when i heard about this air ride leveling gizmo, but i thought that maybe i didn't understand the concept. so basically what i'm hearing is that the components are not strong enough to carry the load so the air bag fills up to hold it up? correct? sounds a little iffy. and what happens if the air pump/bag thingy goes while you're hauling? the hitch/tongue bottom in the middle of the highway? am i missing something?
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Terri
Reg. Jan 2004
Posted 2008-01-21 5:04 PM (#74991 - in reply to #74989)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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 so basically what i'm hearing is that the components are not strong enough to carry the load so the air bag fills up to hold it up?

Not necessarily.  The air bag is adjusted to keep the vehicle level while loaded, but reduces air pressure when empty for a "better" ride.  Just because the air pump needs to kick on doesn't mean the vehicle isn't designed to carry the weight.  It's no different than putting air bags or timebran(sp?) springs on a truck to keep the ride smooth while empty but level while loaded.

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headhunter
Reg. Oct 2004
Posted 2008-01-21 6:02 PM (#75001 - in reply to #74920)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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Just to be fair, Lexus does build three different sizes of SUV's.  The smallest of which has a 3.5L V6 and I would be skeptical of it as a horse trailer tow vehicle.  But the medium and large SUV's have 4.6L and 5.7L (respectively) V8 engines, the largest SUV would probably be comparible to a Suburban or Expedition as a tow vehicle.  Certainly capable of towing a smaller bumper pull, if properly equipped. 
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HWBar
Reg. Nov 2005
Posted 2008-01-21 6:37 PM (#75005 - in reply to #74989)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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Originally written by marta on 2008-01-21 4:37 PM

thanks for all the replies. yes, lexis suv hauling a horse trailer is a scary thing all in itself;) this is a haughty taughty fox hunter we're talking about (i think that speaks for itself;)). i also had concerns when i heard about this air ride leveling gizmo, but i thought that maybe i didn't understand the concept. so basically what i'm hearing is that the components are not strong enough to carry the load so the air bag fills up to hold it up? correct? sounds a little iffy. and what happens if the air pump/bag thingy goes while you're hauling? the hitch/tongue bottom in the middle of the highway? am i missing something?

 

 

The Escalade is equipped with a towing package and has a tow rating of 8,100 lbs., We are well within those numbers.

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chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2008-01-21 7:15 PM (#75008 - in reply to #74975)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?


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Originally written by jdzaharia on 2008-01-21 3:49 PM

Just the fact that a Lexus owner is hauling horses would haunt me. Let alone, you have them for a boarder. Sorry, maybe my view of Lexus owners is slightly skewed in this area of the country.
Originally written by HWBar on 2008-01-21 2:09 PM My wifes Escalade has a rear air bags with self leveling feature, I can hook up a 3 horse slant bumper pull and it will squat down, wait about 30 seconds and you will hear the air pump kick on and it will relevel itself. I like it alot, better than weight distribution bars.
Two entirely different things, aren't they? The idea of a weight distributing hitch is to distribute some of the weight from the rear axle to the front axle and trailer axles. Levelling the ride is a benefit, but more by default than by design. Air bags level the ride, but the weight carried by the rear axle will still be the same.

Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong.

You are not wrong.  "What" you are, is overlooking the fact a 1/2 ton (pickup or suv) does not need WDH for ~600# tongue weight.  Just because it squats down more does not indicate more weight transfer.  Take the softly sprung suv drop the 600# on the ball and it may squat 6"......the springs are meant for comfort.  Take the same 600# drop it on a pickup and it may squat 3"........the springs are meant to carry a load.   In both examples, assuming similar wheelbase and overhang, the same amount of weight is removed from the front axle.  A WDH can lift the rear of a softly sprung vehicle without necessarily "distributing" weight, the same as air bag suspensions.

A WDH is all about leverage.  With the trailer in my sig (~900# tongue) hooked to the Trailblazer I NEEDED a WDH.  Something like 400# was removed from the front axles 2400#.  With the wheelbase and low vehicle weight of the Trailblazer hitched without the WDH the F/R distribution was 36% F  64% R......made for lousy handling.  A WDH returned the weight to the front axle and restored the handling.  Same trailer on the new 3/4 ton Dmax does not require a WDH as more front axle weight to start with means less % of weight moved to the rear.



Edited by chadsalt 2008-01-21 7:26 PM
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chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2008-01-21 7:24 PM (#75010 - in reply to #74989)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?


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Originally written by marta on 2008-01-21 5:37 PM

thanks for all the replies. yes, lexis suv hauling a horse trailer is a scary thing all in itself;) this is a haughty taughty fox hunter we're talking about (i think that speaks for itself;)). i also had concerns when i heard about this air ride leveling gizmo, but i thought that maybe i didn't understand the concept. so basically what i'm hearing is that the components are not strong enough to carry the load so the air bag fills up to hold it up? correct? sounds a little iffy. and what happens if the air pump/bag thingy goes while you're hauling? the hitch/tongue bottom in the middle of the highway? am i missing something?

Most over the road tractor trailers use air bag suspensions.  It has nothing to do with being "strong enough", they still have their axle ratings......with air bags they simply dont squat like a conventional spring suspension.  There  is nothing "scary" about towing with a suv, Lexus or otherwise.  Fear of towing with an suv is a silly and antiquated notion, nearly ALL modern midsize (let alone a full size) suvs are capable of safely towing a 2h BP......the driver is another matter.



Edited by chadsalt 2008-01-21 8:38 PM
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HWBar
Reg. Nov 2005
Posted 2008-01-22 6:05 AM (#75035 - in reply to #74920)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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It's real funny I was talking with a guy the other day about this same stuff, I remember well loading up my 1967 Chevrolet 1/2 ton truck with 3,200 lbs of tobacco and taking it to market, I was really proud that day because also along for that trip that day was my father in his half ton 1974(new) 4 wheel drive truck, he had 2,800lbs. and my grandfather with his 1973 1/2 ton pick-up he had 2,600lbs. The real kicker to this story is I was 17 years old, the tobacco warehouse was 40 miles from home. I can still feel how light the front end was on that old truck. In todays world everyone would want to put my dad in jail for letting a 17 year old make that trip. In my world, I was not the only 17 year old driving to the warehouse that day.

Times change and so does the thinking about what is right and what is wrong. Today in my state you don't even get to drive until you are almost 17, everyone on the internet thinks you have to have a Crew Cab Dually to pull a trailer, I say I would rather have my wife in her Escalade pulling 6,500 lbs. than alot of men I see pulling 2,000 lbs. with a CC dually.

I was raised on a farm and had been driving since I was 12, working for my dad in fields, dealing with farm workers, and doing as I was told, my dad knew exactly what he was doing when he put a few extra pounds on "MY" truck.

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jdzaharia
Reg. Apr 2006
Posted 2008-01-22 10:00 AM (#75059 - in reply to #74920)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?



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headhunter, if you re-read my first post, I wasn't questioning the capability of the SUV... Ha ha.

chadsalt, I realize the amount of "squat" between two dissimilar vehicles cannot be correlated to a similar amount of weight transfer. But, I disagree with this statement:

Originally written by chadsalt on 2008-01-21 7:15 PM

A WDH can lift the rear of a softly sprung vehicle without necessarily "distributing" weight


If the rear is being lifted, some weight is being removed from that axle. The weight has to go somewhere. And the other axles are that "somewhere." I do see your point, though. For a softly sprung vehicle, add the word "much" to your statement between the words "distributing" and "weight" and I'm on board with you.

HWBar, I would agree that your Escalade probably doesn't need a WDH for your load. Some people may choose to use one, some may not.
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chadsalt
Reg. Nov 2004
Posted 2008-01-22 1:58 PM (#75080 - in reply to #75059)
Subject: RE: leveling button for hauling?


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Originally written by jdzaharia on 2008-01-22 10:00 AM chadsalt, I realize the amount of "squat" between two dissimilar vehicles cannot be correlated to a similar amount of weight transfer. But, I disagree with this statement:
Originally written by chadsalt on 2008-01-21 7:15 PM A WDH can lift the rear of a softly sprung vehicle without necessarily "distributing" weight
If the rear is being lifted, some weight is being removed from that axle. The weight has to go somewhere. And the other axles are that "somewhere." I do see your point, though. For a softly sprung vehicle, add the word "much" to your statement between the words "distributing" and "weight" and I'm on board with you.

Close enough for this forum discussion. We appear to be in the same ballpark.



Edited by chadsalt 2008-01-22 2:02 PM
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