I vented earlier about this 7 year old horse of mine. He gets anxious on trail around groups of horses. Standing around them he is fine. He acts insecure. Anyhoo, a couple of people said that QH's mentally change/mature at around 8 years old. Has anyone else heard of this? Because if after next year he doesn't "mature" he's going to be sold. My last weekend group ride was horrible. Although I made him do what I asked, he jigged/tried to canter in place the whole time. He never wore out but I was exhausted. I took him back out on trail after the first 4 hour hell ride with just two other riders. He was better but when he saw a group riding in the distance I had a difficult time making him stand. No matter how many circles, back ups, side passes, going around trees etc., I couldn't get his mind off the other horses. He loads, trailers, ties, great demeanor, easy keeper, excellent health, excellent feet, pickets, great conformation, smart, great ground manners, great for the farrier. All of this means nothing if we can't get past the group issue. My trainer doesn't want to deal with older horse issues. I can't blame him.
Posted 2009-11-17 6:49 AM (#113266 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Expert
Posts: 1723 Location: michigan
I am not so sure about that theory. I'd be more likely to say that at a certain age his basic personality is set. I don't think its a matter of maturity as much as this is the way he is. Some horses just need to be apart of the pack while other are content to not to. Not all horses make nice,quiet trail mounts maybe this one needs a bit more excitement in her life.
Posted 2009-11-17 12:56 PM (#113281 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Veteran
Posts: 270 Location: Roanoke IL
My horse didn't mature till she was halfway through her 5 year old season. I was going to either kill her or she was going to kill me. We bucked, fussed, spun, swirled, crashed through trees, were hooked on buddies, and couldn't go out alone.... Then the lightbulb came on. She' perfect now. It CAN happen, but few just wake up one day and decide to grow a brain. What did the best for me was riding solo. She began to focus on me more, and other horses less.
Is he wound up even if you hand lead him around other horses? Habits get ingrained quickly, if he has always been this way, he probably will always be that way.
Does he get better if he's in front?
How often do you ride him?
Does he have a bit that causes him to be more nervous when you apply pressure?
Have you tried calm & cool?
Is it just a big motor, or fear/nerves?
Does he have good trail manners when you ride solo? Try riding solo, then add one horse, then when he's going good, add another.
What about ponying him? See if he's still wound when being ponied.
There's a lot I'd try before getting rid of him. Trail riding shouldn't be miserable. Selling him as a roping horse prospect still involves a great amount of group involvement, its doubtful he'll get much better in a more hectic environment.
He sounds fun... for a few rides...then I can see how it would get old. I bet your trail riding buddies don't appreciate his antics.
Amanda
Posted 2009-11-17 6:10 PM (#113304 - in reply to #113281) Subject: RE: QH
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1069 Location: MI.
He is fine being lead around other horses. He is a great leader on trail, very confident....he walks right out with a loose rein. When I ride with a smaller group, he will take center and rear without any major issues. He hasn't been expose to alot which he should've been exposed to when he was younger. During riding season, I ride twice a week but long rides. When he is calm he responds well to the bit I use (he acted the same with the bit the previous owner used.) I have dosed him with calming aids and they don't work. He has a huge motor...I think he has fear because he hasn't had the exposure. His trail manners are good alone and with a large group. He just wants to be in the middle of them. I rode/ride him solo and added another horse and then took him to a horse camp to see horses coming and going etc. Gradual.....He camps/pickets great! Still.....Ya know, earlier this year, there was a 50 horse ride and for about 2 hours he was terrible which I expected. But after the first trail ride break, he walked out on a loose rein and listened to me the rest of the 6 hour ride. I thought ok, I can deal with this because he does show signs of hope. A week later I took him on another large ride and expected the same jiggy crap for the first part of the ride. Well he didn't do it at all......I absolutely loved him on that day! I thought wow! It will take work but we are going to work through it. Well after that (alot of day rides with another rider in between which were for the most part good) brings me to the last ride/campout. So, here we are......My heart aches because I have gotten attached to him. I can't have "fun" with him right now because I am basically still teaching him trail manners (walking down hills and not bolting etc., etc., etc. and the list is never ending)
I am going to try riding him solo more often.....He will have to focus on me. It does make sense. I am nearing the end of my patience...
Posted 2009-11-17 6:21 PM (#113305 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Veteran
Posts: 270 Location: Roanoke IL
Ignore the age. How would you expect a two year old to act with the same amount of training and experience? Older doesn't mean smarter unless he's been exposed to everything over the years. I think some more wet saddle pads and he'll be okay. Just keep the ride groups small and go solo a lot to build his confidence. Make it a positive experience. Older horses don't learn as quickly as a yearling or two year old would. You can teach an old dog new tricks, but it may take more effort...which is why a lot of the trainers don't wanna touch older horses. It takes longer, and is tougher. The babies are like such little sponges.. the older ones not so much. If you wanna stick with him, your consistency will pay off. You could have a hell of a good horse.
Amanda
Posted 2009-11-18 10:24 AM (#113349 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Elite Veteran
Posts: 714 Location: Minnesota
Reminds me of a QH gelding I had. Could be the best horse or the worst horse, you just never knew which was going to come out. Rode him as a two year old until he was eight. He did get a LOT better after turning five, but never totally came around. Sold him as an eight year old because I had been riding a two year old exclusively that year and he sat in the pasture with the mares all summer. Buyer came to look at him and wanted me to saddle and ride him. I admit That I was a little nervous because he hadn't been ridden in 10 months. Got on and rode him in the open and he was perfect. Did everything I asked. Seemed really happy to actually doing something.
Sometimes I think they need time to get really bored so that they figure out that it's fun for them when we ride them.
Posted 2009-11-22 5:20 PM (#113503 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1069 Location: MI.
I phoned my trainer and left a message in hopes he can offer some advice or take him for a while. He mentioned earlier this year on a ride he doesn't take older problem horses but he is my last hope....
Posted 2009-11-22 8:50 PM (#113506 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Elite Veteran
Posts: 681 Location: Corpus Christi, Texas
It took my rocky mare 2 years to settle down and start trusting me..I had just made up my mind to sell her because I was tired of having to re desensitize her each and every time and STILL having her nearly jump out from under me at a grasshopper taking off under her nose or a clod of dirt being kicked out of her hoof and landing in front of her... i put her on a long line, attached a plastic back to a long light pole and held it to her back (after sacking her with it) and let her run around in circles until she dropped her head and licked her lips.. I luckily let her stop just at that instant.. I don't know what clicked in her head, but she has been my best, most treasured horse since then.. I know my situation is not the same as yours, but my main message is DO NOT GIVE UP HOPE!!
Posted 2009-11-23 7:44 AM (#113513 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Expert
Posts: 2453 Location: Northern Utah
I had a big grey foxtrotter, That just couldn't stand to see a horse in front of him. As we did CTR rides he aways thought he needed to catch who ever was in front of him. I'd get dingged points at the end of the day for his lips and chin being chewed up from the bit and me pulling on it all day trying to get him to slow down. Like others posted,We spun, we did half halts, we danced around trees. At the end of the day, he would have wear marks from the bit and a sore back loins from not being collected all day.
I spent some time riding alone. Getting him to focus on me. Teaching him to drop his head and relax on cue. And then I went back and did the group rides again. And keep him at the back of the group all day. In fact I was invited at the last minute to come on a desert ride with some friends. One of the friends confided to me the reason they had not invited me earlier was because my horse always moved out so fast and I dragged everybody else along at my speed. So I made it a point to spend the entire ride bringing up the rear. On the way home the friend who had confided to me, Said, "Gee your horse was the best behaved of the whole group. They guy who was complaining the most about your horse had the worst horse on the trail"
So yes they can change. But it will take some work. There is no magic age when they just decide to behave. It's more a matter of focused training. Teaching that horse that he needs to relax when you ask him to.
Posted 2009-11-23 11:51 AM (#113520 - in reply to #113265) Subject: QH
Regular
Posts: 63 Location: Eagle, Idaho
Reminds me of a QH gelding which I purchased as a three year old. He was a goey kind of horse and very sensitive. I rode him a ton and the older he got the worse he got. The last big group ride he went on he cantered at a walk speed for the entire ride. In drill team he started rearing and lunging. Then I began doing jump lessons with him. The instructor decided she could handle him better then me so she rode him and told me often horses who acted like that could be sore. Next lesson we put him on a lunge line and troted him on a hard surface--no lameness showed. The very next week he was dead lame--at 6 years old. Had diagnostics done on him and he had sesamoiditis with fractures. Laid him off for 6 months and then did retesting. He never recovered.
He's now 19 years old--has been a pasture ornament since he was six--he's still a beautiful horse and a nice pet. He's a big blood bay with Mr. San Peppy and Doc Bar breeding close up.
So I'm saying sometimes a horse can be nervous and hyped up because he's hurting. Just something to think about.
Posted 2009-11-23 4:39 PM (#113535 - in reply to #113265) Subject: RE: QH
Elite Veteran
Posts: 1069 Location: MI.
My trainer called me back and he feels confident in getting him through this. He has dealt with this issue quite a bit. He's going to take him in March so I can keep riding him right up until gun season. If there happens to be any underlying lameness issues I'm confident my trainer will pay attention and let me know. He's going to basically "retrain" him. I do hope for a postive outcome.
QH
