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Unwanted horses

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notfromtexas
Reg. Jan 2007
Posted 2007-09-29 8:38 AM (#68565 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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Posts: 294
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Location: Fort Worth, Tx
In Texas, there is actually some kind of tax incentive to breed.  I know a woman who breeds one of her mares every year because it qualifies her for some kind of agricultural status (I believe the horse has to be on her acreage), and therefore a tax break.  It's frustrating because most of us with large animals need all the tax breaks we can get, yet this particular individual has no business breeding her mares-they are very poor quality.  I'm sure many other states have similar "incentives".
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hconley
Reg. Feb 2005
Posted 2007-09-29 10:03 AM (#68571 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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Unless you can tell me the name of this so-called "tax incentive to breed horses" I don't believe it for a minute. To many mystical myths start off by "I have a friend" or "I know someone" So if the state of Texas is giving tax breaks just to breed a horse, Texas has already been messed with.
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Yvette
Reg. Jul 2006
Posted 2007-09-29 11:35 AM (#68576 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses



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The tax incentive isn't to specifically breed horses, however for her acreage she needs to do something considered agricultural to qualify for agriculture property taxes rather than residential/single resident property taxes. The agricultural taxes being lower.

This woman chose the simplest way for her by breeding horses. I have a friend that rather than breeding horses, leases her back 5 acres to the farmer next to her for planting crops. Thus she can claim agricultural taxes and save money.

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Yvette
Reg. Jul 2006
Posted 2007-09-29 1:00 PM (#68577 - in reply to #68278)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses



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Originally written by Terri on 2007-09-23 12:23 PM

I'll agree with SOME of your post. 

It has been illegal for quite a while to ship horses in a double decker cattle trailer and it is illegal to ship horses out of country for the purpose of slaughter.  I am sure that there are people that ignore the rules, there always are.  And as far as TX "closing their plants easiest" I have relatives that lived near one of the plants and nothing about it was easy.  People were fighting to keep the plants open if for no other reason than to help people keep their jobs.  I lived in Tx when the plants were closed, I've been in NM for just over a year and if they wanted (and were allowed to do so) to build a slaughter plant here I wouldn't have a problem with it.  The only difference between horse and cattle slaughter is the "pet" status many of us give our horses.    I personally wouldn't eat a horse (or deer/elk or rabbit) unless I was starving but who am I to tell someone else they are wrong and evil for doing it? 

You can rant at me all you want, I don't care.  I don't think the plants should have been closed.

 

No ranting from me, only suggesting that those that really, really want to slaughter horses find a state that would like to accommodate the practice. I've been fairly neutral, though I can say I've never condoned the slaughter of horses. I certainly have been appalled as a caring human being as to how horses are treated on the way to that horrible fate.

Maybe double deckers for horses are supposed to be illegal for horse transport, but that doesn't stop them from being used. There was the controversial roll over of a double decker with horses three years ago in Kentucky that killed 20 some horses.

It seem there was another one in Missouri in December 2006. http://www.thehorse.com/ViewArticle.aspx?ID=8295&nID=14

As far as I can see only certain states have passed their own laws prohibiting the use of double decker cattle trailers for horses and only a handful at that.

http://www.equineprotectionnetwork.com/transport/transportindex.htm

And no worries horses are still being shipped to Canada and Mexico for slaughter. They really are.

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Terri
Reg. Jan 2004
Posted 2007-09-29 3:56 PM (#68580 - in reply to #68562)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses



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I don't think raising the registeration fees would do much.  I think it would lead to more horses that don't have their papers sent in or fewer people buying registered horses.  I know that the guy that bought my gelding when I moved has not and said he will not transfer the papers because he doesn't want to pay for a $50 membership fee on top of the transfer fee.

 

 

Is it just me or is the time wrong on all the posts?  Its NOT 4am, its 3pm.



Edited by Terri 2007-09-29 4:01 PM
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notfromtexas
Reg. Jan 2007
Posted 2007-09-29 10:13 PM (#68590 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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Location: Fort Worth, Tx

Thank you Yvette, you explained it much better than I.  She does receive ag status for having a foal born every other year.  Again I am sure many other states have such incentives.   One of those crazy goverment things, like paying farmers not to grow things!

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hconley
Reg. Feb 2005
Posted 2007-09-29 10:59 PM (#68592 - in reply to #68580)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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Originally written by Terri on 2007-09-29 3:56 PM

I don't think raising the registeration fees would do much.  I think it would lead to more horses that don't have their papers sent in or fewer people buying registered horses.  I know that the guy that bought my gelding when I moved has not and said he will not transfer the papers because he doesn't want to pay for a $50 membership fee on top of the transfer fee.

 

Again I said transfer fees would remain the same.There are people who are not breeding horses, yet want the added value of a registered horse.



Edited by hconley 2007-09-29 11:02 PM
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mrstacticalmedic
Reg. Dec 2005
Posted 2007-10-01 4:23 PM (#68682 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses



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Location: Allegan, Michigan

Raising the fees would not do any good.  It costs $200 to register a TB and yet look how many are foaled each year, and look how many get used up each year.  CANTER can not keep up with them.  Also Michigan's Great Lakes Downs is set to close this year and that will send literally thousands more to auctions as with fuel prices being so high, many of the trainers won't go to Beulah, or Mountaineer, or down south to race.  We are already seeing people setting horses loose in state parks and rural areas.  There was a big thing about it down in Indiana.   You can't give horses away right now.   The market is over saturated.  Thanks to the wonderful pushing of the anti slaughter bill horses are being inhumanely treated in Mexico.  Go visit the slaughter plant down there.  

I think slaughter is a necessary evil, I am not on this planet to judge others who choose to eat horses, just as I would hope others don't judge me for eating beef, poultry or pork.   Shoot...dairy cattle are more inhumanely treated than slaughtered horses.  They have their tails docked so they can't swish at flies (thought is they contaminate the milk when swishing their tails as they are being milked).  Turkeys have their beaks cut off so they don't  peck eachother.  Yet I see everyone sliding up to the table on Thanksgiving to eat their fill.  Yet you folks aren't clamoring over that.

That poor nag down the road, the one the Amish worked so hard and stoved up isn't going to get a quick death now, but will be starved because they won't feed a useless animal.  How humane is that?  Oh by the way...they don't prosecute the Amish because of their religious beliefs. 

The Amish do breed indescriminately yet there is nothing we can do about it.  You also have those breeding their well bred stallion and well bred mare, and you can NOT guarantee good conformation even though the two have great conformation.  There is no guarantee in breeding except for homozygous color traits.  

I have seen myself a 250k stallion bred to a 100k mare, the foal came out roman nosed and has mutton withers, short necked and long coupled. 

Yet I have seen a horse that had conformational issues  bred to a nice stallion and have a drop dead gorgeous foal that went on to win big time. 

What needs to be done is the stallion owners need to be more responsible.  Slaughter does need to be kept, but have the laws enforced and more stringent requirements for slaughter.  The horse has to be examined by a vet and a professional certified trainer, and certified unfit for rehabilitation whether soundness or mentally. 

Before going through the auction ring each horse should be evaluated.  If found unfit for a prosperous life then send it through a separate ring.  If found to have potential put it through and restrict the slaughter folks from bidding on them.

 

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notfromtexas
Reg. Jan 2007
Posted 2007-10-01 5:32 PM (#68684 - in reply to #68682)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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Wow, what did the Amish do to you?  I am originally from Amish country and all the Amish I knew were great horse owners and knew more about breeding and care than most people.  And I don't know what you mean about the Amish not being prosecuted, if they break the law they are accountable like anyone else.  If you know of a horse being ill used, then report it.  If you get no action from your local law enforcement agency, then call the tv networks and see if they can help light a fire.
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calamityj
Reg. Jun 2005
Posted 2007-10-01 5:47 PM (#68686 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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notfromtx... come on up to my neighborhood and take a look at the great care these Amish horses get. HA! like the problems they themselves have with severe inbreeding (a well publisized fact, not an opinion), the horses are troubled. However, they are worked half to death before they are five... so don't get any misty eyed, romantic ideas about these people or their animals... really. I'd rather be eaten than driven hard down a highway for hours in 100* heat.
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hconley
Reg. Feb 2005
Posted 2007-10-01 6:58 PM (#68692 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses


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Location: Nebraska
I don't eat fowl in any way shape or form, it doesn't even enter my home. Anyway as of now there is no incentive for the stallion owners not to breed any mare that comes along. And they want to breed as many mares as the stud can handle. The only options open are a cash incentive for barren mares or the associations to be tougher on registation.

Where would the money come from for a vet check and trainer check, for what you would pay them, a person would have to pay money to sale a horse. The horse industry depends on buying and selling horses, and it also depends on the profit.
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mrstacticalmedic
Reg. Dec 2005
Posted 2007-10-01 9:37 PM (#68705 - in reply to #66086)
Subject: RE: Unwanted horses



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Posts: 362
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Location: Allegan, Michigan
Just like any job, the vet and trainer would get a set fee for the auction.  Just like we have to pay for a coggins test, pay a $25 fee for vet and trainer to examine the horse.  Would be worth it to me.
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