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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Are there any Missouri Fox Trotter owners out there? I just purchased a MFT filly 3yro 15.0h The lady I bought her from does Arabs and QH's. I asked her if the horse gaited naturally and she said that she has seen her gait on occassion. My question is how do I go about getting this horse to fox trot....This is a new breed to me. I have ridden one that stayed at a fox trot all day. This filly has just been started under saddle..Any suggestions? Thanks |
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       Location: Northern Utah | The fox trot or any other gait that you want to perfect take time to develope the muscle memory. The horse may have the conformation for a Foxtrot, but it will need to develop the muscles so that it is the horse's perfered gait. Preferred to a hard trot or other diagnal gait. You need to take the horse out and work it at a walk, You will increase the speed of walk , everytime the horse breaks into a hard trot, you need to stop and reset. Over time the horse will develop the muscles that it needs to use for that gait. Just like you becoming physically fit, the horse will develop and be able to maintain that gait. This is not something that happens over night, unless the horse has already developed those muscles and it's already her prefered gait. As you move up from the walk into the Foxtrot, you will do the same push for faster speed and slow down when ever the horse breaks into a rough trot. Lots of wet saddle blankets at what you consider the preferred gaits are needed. If the horse has the breeding and confirmation, you shouldn't have to resort to un-natural means to get the gaits you want ( Chains, weighted shoes etc) Unlike Quarter horses, Foxtrotters need to move with their head up higher, you will push them into the bit. Hold your hands steady and let the horses head pivot on the bit as they shake their head in the gait. Check out the http://www.gaitsofgold.com/ web site for some training articles.
Edited by Painted Horse 2008-04-28 7:54 AM
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| Painted Horse, what bit do you use? I am now using the imus bit and have had very good results. You are right about keeping the head up. Diamond, my foxtrotter wants to get his head low and tucked in and hard trot. As long as I can keep the head up and push him on he gaits really well. It has took me a long time to accomplish this. He has always been on the hard trotty side. |
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      Location: East Tennessee, USA, Planet Earth | congratulations on your new gaited horse. please keep in mind...that your horse is still very young. i would not even be on her back until the fall of her 3rd year or spring of 4th year. you may want to work on ground driving and ground work this year. have fun! |
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Expert
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| Have you seen her foxtrot? It doesn't automatically happen just because it is a foxtrotter,not even in papered horses with the best bloodlines.I've had foxtrotters that were better run/walkers than they were at a foxtrot,and had some that have had a "rough" foxtrot even tho it was a correct foxtrot to watch it.It will take some time and if you are intent on having a perfect foxtrot,and you horse isn't inclined to make that her "best" gait,you may be disappointed.Not trying to discourage,and,congratulations on having what is in my humble opinion,the best breed of gaited horse around! |
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Expert
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| PS didn't mean to sound negative about your young horse just now.Because it is a young horse,you will have to be patient in achieving the gait that you want.I think one of the main problems that occurs in young foxtrotters is: people want to push them for SPEED,and push them too soon.Start out at a good flat foot walk,and be sure your horse is set in that well before advancing.Some horses have to be actively "ridden" as opposed to riding on a loose rein,also.We have a very well bred foxtrotter,but,on the trail,he can't be just ridden casually as my foxtrotter mare on a loose rein.He has to be actively "ridden" if that makes any sense,which,it probably does not. Lee Ziegler wrote an excellent book on gaited breeds including foxtrotters which she was a huge promoter of.You might want to check out some of her writings. |
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Elite Veteran
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      Location: La Cygne, KS | You will also need to work on vertical and horizontal flexion too. If she is riding with her head in the air and not broke at the pole, she is hollowing out her back and thus you will get a hard trot. Yes, MFTs travel with their head elevated, but not nosed out. She needs plenty of ground driving and basic ground manner excercises to strengthen muscles. Once she is able to give to the bit, you should see a noticable improvement in her gait. Also, make sure that her feet are trimmed/shod correctly. This can also affect her gait. Congratulations on your MFT. |
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       Location: Northern Utah | Classygirl, I do have a Imus bit, But I'm not currently using it. I am starting two young foxtroters, 4 year old filly & 5 year old gelding. So I am using a full check snaffle on both since I'm still pulling them around some working on softness, one rein stops etc. They are not ready for any kind of a shank bit or a fixed mouth piece. I think when the horses get a little more mature I'll move them into a Gino Middleton curb bit vs the Imus. http://gmstables.net/bits.htm |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Thanks everyone for the advice. I picked up this filly cheap. I do ride a twh. and raised 1 SSH. I'm not in a hurry to start this girl she is started under saddle so I will probably work on ground driving her some then just some basic saddle starting routines. She won't go on the trail untill I feel she is ready mentally. She does W/T/C from what the owner told me..I bought this filly sight unseen other than ad pics. From what a friend told me she is bred well..I don't know much about the breed other than I want one for the ride...I'll post pics after I get her if I can figure how to do it....Thanks |
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| We do ride our foxtrotters with aluminum bits,however,for another view of long shanked bits on gaited horses,Lee Zeigler's books are very insightful. |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Is it a norm to use a lighter/long shank bit on them or is it your preference? I do know that you can get a non gaited - gaited horse..I had a friend that bought 2 MFT the one he rode he couldn't never get him to fox trot. The other one was automatic and he won't sell him to me.... lol I realize I have a lot to learn about the breed. I do my basics pretty good. I have the APHA and TWH to ride so the MFT will be taken slow in her training until we get to know each other a little better first. I like to gain thier trust some what before I really get to know them, If she is as good as the owner said then I'll give her time to settle into her new barn then see what I really have... I don't take anything personal. I try to learn from everyone's advise... Again thx for your help...I'll try and post pics of her when I get her....Happy trails |
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       Location: Northern Utah | Just like any other young horse, your first bit that you use will be used to pull their head around. Plow rein. Breaking a young horse is not the time for a curb bit. Use a bosal, full check snaffle or something similar that allows you to pull the head around and teach laterial flexation. Once the horse is well under saddle you can advance them into a curb bit. And yes foxtrotter owners seem to favor lightweight aluminum curb bits. And the show folks seem to like the longer shanks. You probably won't need them in a trail horse. |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | I will use a full cheek snaffle to start with....I will spend alot of time on ground work first. Then we'll work the flexion under saddle. I'm not new to training young ones...Just never a gaited one...But I understand what I need to do. If I have any problems I know that I can come back and say hey HTW peeps HELP!!!! You guys are DA Bomb |
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Elite Veteran
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     Location: missouri | I've had horses all my life, but foxtrotters are a new breed to our family. We bought a gorgeous perlino filly as a yearling.. she is now three, and is solid on the trail, stout, intelligent, and willing. I recently bought a champayne gelding (8 yr old) who is learning all over again (successfully). We are probably committing some kind of blasphemy? but we ride on a loose rein. They are both gaiting perfectly. And very RELAXED, while many of our peers horses are lathering up and very tense. Anyway you ride them is certainly a "treat" for tired butts!! Happy Trails. |
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      Location: La Cygne, KS | Mingiz, if you are used to starting colts, then do the same thing to your gaited horse. It is still a horse, not a strange moving creature. The same principles apply. Give to pressure, flex, bend, back, and verbal queues for walk, gait and lope on the lead line. I have taught my MFTs basic dressage movements too. Improved the gait immensly, not to mention great trail manners. Very nice to just apply leg pressure and move over on the trail. |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Thanks...Yes a horse is a horse...I pick her up this Sunday. My mothers day gift from me to me....I can't wait...I'll give her some time to settle in and get familar with her new surroundings. Watch her alot to see her personality. Then go to work... I think I'm starting a breed collection, I have a APHA,TWH,mini, and now a MFT...Gee what's next...ALways wanted a good mule....LOL
I posted pics in the albums of the MFT...Didn't realize I did...DUH!!!!
Edited by mingiz 2008-05-08 5:42 AM
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   Location: Bucksport, Maine | I just wanted to post and say these are all GREAT replies. Too often a post about gaited horses has 50% misinformation! I got an RMH/Arab gelding when he was 6 and I had NO experience with gaited horses... which was supposed to be FINE because he was NOT gaited, he trotted. This is the horse in my avatar. But that first winter we just walked walked walked because of the deep snow... and also working on learning to walk FASTER... and all of a sudden VOILA, he was doing something awful smooth! I checked with Liz Graves (well known gaited trainer, along the lines of Lee Ziegler) and now after two clinics with Liz and a lot of conditioning he has a pretty good foxtrot. Everything posted above was, in my experience, completely true. I will say too, though, that the bit Liz had us working in was a sweet iron eggbutt snaffle that had a roller that covered the single joint in the mouthpiece... haven't seen too many of them online but it worked great for that early gait work. These days, because we use foxtrot as just "another gear" during our regular rides, I just use the same Jim Warner hackamore that I use for endurance riding. Regarding posture and cues... I sit a little bit back on my pockets, keep my shoulders a little bit back, hold my hands higher than usual, and keep the reins shorter than usual. In addition, for the cue I use steady pressure with both calves, and kiss to him. These days all I need to do is "assume the position" and he just goes. I did a little demo at a local Expo a couple weeks ago where I transitioned between trot and foxtrot just to show the crowd what a little change in posture would do. They were very interested; it was a lot of fun. Here's a video from our second Liz clinic. At this stage he was "foxwalking". http://www.zegifts.com/Design/Assets/images/Zephyr-Foxwalk.WMV And here's the foxtrot, several years later. Sorry about the Bear Bells, I didn't expect to be videoing. Also please excuse my posture, he was being a bit of a butthead about staying in gait (wanted to canter) so I was exaggerating everything. Finally, I KNOW this is not an acceptable "show" foxtrot because he doesn't really have a relaxed and shaky head/neck... but that's fine with me because it's SMOOTH and he likes it. It's called a "trail foxtrot" according to one website I've found. http://www.zegifts.com/Design/Assets/images/zephyrfoxtrot.wmv Here's the website about the Trail Foxtrot: http://www.foxtrotters.org/foxtrotting_horse_videos.htm
Edited by Sharon 2008-05-08 10:17 AM
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Wow there's some great information there....Thanks for the url.... |
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| That looks a little fast and choppy in the front to be a foxtrot.The hoofbeat cadence doesn't sound like it on the pavement. |
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   Location: Bucksport, Maine | Yeah every time I post it I brace myself for comments like that, but I've sent the video to Liz Graves and she says it's a foxtrot. She does know what she's talking about. http://www.lizgraves.com/ Keep in mind this is being performed by a horse who is not a MFT, who learned to do this later in life, and who was fighting to canter that day. Also, this is a very low-res video so it looks choppy anyway. Here it is, slowed down: http://www.zegifts.com/Design/Assets/images/zephyr-foxtrot-slow.wmv
Edited by Sharon 2008-05-10 9:26 AM
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| Yes,I watched the video,and I see it.Many horses that are not foxtrotters perform the gait and a horse being a papered foxtrotter doesn't guarantee that it will perform it,either.To me,the important question is this: is your horse SMOOTH no matter what gait it is traveling at? Are you getting a good ride? That is the hallmark of a good gaited horse. |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Well everyone I picked up the filly yesterday.Or should I say I rescued a filly yesterday. I got there and the woman never even cleaned her up etc.This wasn't the horse I saw in the ad. I felt so bad for her I bought her. This woman had no coggins etc for this filly.I did get her MFT papers. Her tail has a softball size tangled knot in it.Looks like she may have some rain rot also..she loaded onto the trailer and her 3hr ride home was quiet..She seems very laid back..I taped her to see what her weight was and at 15h she only weighs 679 lbs. I have my work cut out..I posted pics I recieved of her from the owner. I will try and post the ones I took yesterday after I got her home...What irks me is this womans website is totally not what she has..Very nasty farm she has...I still feel like calling animal control in that county on her. |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | I can't get the links to work to post pics....See if this works..May have to copy and paste to anew browser...http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u93/mingiz/Big%20Horn%20Saddle/SKYE%20May%2011-08/
Edited by mingiz 2008-05-12 7:42 AM
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| Joanny,NEVER buy a horse that does not have a current negative Coggins test.Nor take one as a donation,either.Where we live,that can cause you all kinds of unwanted problems. I could not get the link to copy/paste,either. What is her website?
Edited by crowleysridgegirl 2008-05-12 8:45 AM
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | I don't usually get one without a coggins...But this one needed help..So i took the chance...She is separate from the others for now....I'm having the vet come out and give her a good once over. I already wormed her, as soon as this nasty wet weather clears up I will give her a good bath and go from there..So far she seems to appreciate her new home..Her (seller)website is http://www.sunsetarabians.com/ But the site and the actual farm aren't/can't be the same.....Or it has gone to hell since the site was put together...the pics of SKYE I took are at: http://s166.photobucket.com/albums/u93/mingiz/Big%20Horn%20Saddle/S... |
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   Location: Bucksport, Maine | I'm very sorry she wasn't what she was billed to be. Hopefully you can make her healthy and happy. |
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| Originally written by mingiz on 2008-05-12 5:50 AM
Well everyone I picked up the filly yesterday.Or should I say I rescued a filly yesterday. I got there and the woman never even cleaned her up etc.This wasn't the horse I saw in the ad. I felt so bad for her I bought her. This woman had no coggins etc for this filly.I did get her MFT papers. Her tail has a softball size tangled knot in it.Looks like she may have some rain rot also..she loaded onto the trailer and her 3hr ride home was quiet..She seems very laid back..I taped her to see what her weight was and at 15h she only weighs 679 lbs. I have my work cut out..I posted pics I recieved of her from the owner. I will try and post the ones I took yesterday after I got her home...What irks me is this womans website is totally not what she has..Very nasty farm she has...I still feel like calling animal control in that county on her. She is the same horse in the ad,only,the ad pic was made in March.I'd say she stopped feeding her along about then. |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | Well I don't know how much good it will do but I informed the local animal control for that county about this horse and the woman that owned her.....Skye is doing well and is settling in very well. She loves her stall and her blankie and of course her food...I have the vet coming to check her over and give her shots etc..Her feet look good. I think she realizes that she has a good home now...She hasn't done anything to threaten me or even shows any signs of it. I think this girl will do ok..I have seen and helped worst...I know that a few of you are concerned that I brought her home without a coggins. I have her separate form the other 2 and other than being hungry she doesn't show any signs of sickness. I know you may not see it..But I have been around long enough to know....I will keep you guys posted on her progress....She really is a sweety....I don't regret taking her...Well I'm going to send the past owner am email today and tell her that she isn't worth a damn as a horse person and shouldn't be in a breeding business. She isn't breeding MFT she has arabians...I didn't see too many horses there but what I did see. Skye was the worst...Just makes me want to go back there and beat the living hell out of that woman...Ok vented....Morning ALL.....Thanks for all your concern |
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| shows any signs of it. I think this girl will do ok..I have seen and helped worst...I know that a few of you are concerned that I brought her home without a coggins. I have her separate form the other 2 and other than being hungry she doesn't show any signs of sickness. I know you may not see it..But I have been around long enough to know.... Just to say that: they can have positive Coggins test,and not show signs of illness for a while.The gentleman that I PM'd you about,that lost his entire herd because his neighbors would not COggins test theirs,said not a one of his was ill with signs,but all had positive Coggins when they were infected.You might want to check the quarantine distances,you will be surprised at the distance of it from other horses.It is not merely separating them on your property.More than likely she is OK but just to say that my husband recently went through Coggins certification training,and our vet has told us what can happen if any of ours were to test positive.If they cannot be quarantined properly for the length of time required they must be euthanized. That being said,I wonder how this lady "breeder " of Arabians (or crossbreeds,it looks like,on her website) came by the horse.Does your filly have papers,or,did she just tell you that she is a "foxtrotter." People kill me that say they have a "foxtrotter" when it is really a grade gaited horse,and that's all.It could be any gaited breed besides a foxtrotter.If you have any doubts about the papers,you might want to contact the MFTHBA at Ava,MO. That being said too,I am glad that the filly went to a concerned and caring person like YOU.I believe she would have starved there,she got pretty thin from her original picture until now.I hope animal control goes to her place and inspects things.Be prepared for her to lie to them about you. |
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Extreme Veteran
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      Location: Missouri | After too many years of trying to develop gaited horses into true gaiting, we've found it cheaper in the long run to only buy those that are naturally gaited from the get go. Yes, you can teach a QH to foxtrot, running walk, or rack, BUT. It is time consuming and many time more frustrating than it's worth. And Yes, there are a few naturally gaited Foxtrotter's, but very few. The majority have to be taught the gait, and either have a trainer periodically tune them up, or the owner has to learn how themself.
I don't buy into the concept, that they have to be muscled up to gait. Yes, you can train them to gait using muscle conditioning and anyone of many more techniques, but, here again, is it worth the time, investment and effort, verses, buying them naturally gaited. If they are naturally gaited they will gait from the very beginning.
Too many times a cheap initial investment costs more in the long run than one already gaiting and ready to go. |
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   Location: Bucksport, Maine | Hi Bob, nice to see you here! I agree, if someone is looking for a gaited horse, it's best to look for natural gait. She'd already purchased this one by the time she posted here, though, so we're just doing our best to help her out. |
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| mingiz,I've seen your filly's sire in person,he is a very beautiful horse.She has good papers!!! |
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    Location: Vanzant, Missouri | I got a response back from animal control in her county. I sent the same pics that I posted. Even if she lies about me I have 2 witness's that were with me when I picked her up. If animal control over there needs me to show up for a hearing. I'll be gone in a flash.... At this point I don't care if this filly gaits or not. I know a guy that had 2 MFT, one would foxtrot it's butt off and the other never did even after training. If she turns out just to be a smooth ride that will be fine too.. My main thing is there are not many if any MFT around here. And if there are they are priced out of the wazoo. If I could afford the fuel or transport to go to the midwest areas to get one I would have a long time ago... I don't like buying sight unseen either...But for the most part I have one she isn't much now but just wait.... I figure pretty is as pretty does |
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| Most people's mistake is in riding them early on,they try to push them for speed.They aren't bred to be speed rackers,and aren't shown as such.Go on the Missouri Foxtrotter's website,and you will learn about the average flat foot walk,foxtrot,ect and the rate of speed that they can travel at.Why's it all about "speed" anyway? Most trail riders don't want to go through the woods lickety split getting their kneecaps knocked off on trees.If you tried racking through the terrain WE camped and rode at,Big Creek,Hartshorn MO,a couple of weeks ago,you'd be lucky to stay on,plus,not wind up with you and your horse tripping and falling on their face and dumping you off.Speed isn't necessarily king on the trails,it can be dangerous.WHen I want my foxtrotters to get on up and walk on a flat terrain,don't worry,they can deliver it.But through rocky trails up high ridges and down,it is downright careless and dangerous.Take it from me,you can get hurt.I had a mare that I sold because she had no idea how to negotiate a trail at a slow and safe speed.She'd been ridden wide open,and that's all she knew how to do.I nearly got my knee broken on a narrow trail riding her,so,she had to go.My mare now will foxtrot,and when called upon can do it,but on the trail,I want something that has a #1 priority of not getting hurt,thus,not getting ME hurt. |
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| In addition to the website that has your filly's sire on it,you might enjoy looking at this one:www.missourifoxtrottersatoz.com which lists some of the breed's foundation sires and has pictures,very informative site. On this site look at the link "colors" and near the bottom of the page,you will find another picture of your filly's sire.He is a smutty palomino.
Edited by crowleysridgegirl 2008-05-13 6:43 PM
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      Location: La Cygne, KS | I wish markings were indicated on MFT papers like for Arabs, QHs papers etc. Not just the verbiage. If the papers were marked, the poster could be sure she got the correct horse since she has the cute white spot on her nose. I am glad to see DNA testing being required now for the MFTs, but it is going to take awhile to get the breed up to standards of other registeries. |
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Extreme Veteran
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      Location: Missouri | DNA testing is only part of the picture. DNA is useless if they are not gaited. You can not ride DNA, but you do ride gait. Too bad they don't have the certification similar to the KMSH. |
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